Online wilderness first aid class? Experience and/or comments?

[UCanoe_2]

I'm on the safety committee of our local river conservation non-profit. We do an annual river cleanup, and from time to time run organized river trips. Lately we have been discussing preparedness and response to accidents. Everybody agrees that CPR training for trip leaders would be good to have. I am advocating also for basic first aid training -- we are much more likely to need to administer first aid than CPR.

Our local river runs through a settled rural area, and is not wilderness by any stretch of the imagination. Still, there are plenty of spots where access for emergency services would be limited by terrain or absence of roads. IMO we need to be prepared for delayed response by the rescue squad, and even for evacuating an injured person by canoe.

Red Cross standard first aid is pretty elementary and oriented to civilized areas with quick 911 response. Some years ago I took SOLO wilderness first aid. I found it much more applicable to river trips, and the hands-on skills lessons were downright fun. It would be nice if all our trip leaders could take SOLO WFA, but it costs $245 (not in the budget for a shoestring non-profit) and requires a time commitment of two very long days.

Then I found out about online WFA and WFR classes offered by Survival Med. https://survivalmedonline.org/ The instructors are MDs or first responders with backcountry experience. They have affiliation with the University of Utah wilderness medicine program. The courses are online, self-paced, and WFA costs only $35. Certification is good for 3 years. They offer courses specific to various regions of the US. Courses include a basic wilderness life support textbook in PDF format for use with smart phones, as well as lifetime access to wilderness medicine podcasts. Here's a link to the curriculum outline: https://cdn.aelieve.com/13ef9cbb-survival-med-wfa-curriculum-092622.pdf

Does anybody have experience or comments regarding this or similar online WFA training? It looks pretty good to me, and I am considering putting out $35 to check it out. Your thoughts will be appreciated.

 

[billconner]

Can't comment. Took WFA as part of Scouts. Troop paid for any adult leader, and a few older Scouts. Basically hired an instructor.

I'd done it before in prep for Philmont - seemed like through a college and maybe $140? Two 8 hour days.

I'd say your online is much better than not doing it, but I liked the live instruction. I found one place offering live instruction - $200 - but most were $300-400 or more. I did see Red Cross offered online and it looked like no cost, but I didn't burrow into it. Probably price shows up at end of the registration.

 

[Gamma1214]

I've never done something like this online but, unless one or more of the medical professionals on here chimes in and says that remote training is insufficient, I'll be signing up. $35 is cheap and I often spend more than that on supper.

Thanks for the links.

 

[ScottS]

The last time I took wilderness first aid, it included re-enactment exercises with live actors.
I think that the triage/field assessment process is important.
My opinion is that you are going to get what you paid for, instead of what you need.

 

[madmike]

I was WFR trained / certified for 13 years to work with college students in a remote setting. Course was $700+ and took 8, 8 hour days plus homework. If you can swing it, go more comprehensive.

 

[yellowcanoe]

never seen online training. But at that price it couldn't hurt. But the regionality flummoxes me.. All bleeding stops. It doesn't matter where you are. What you want to be able to do is make it stop before shock does.

The body wants to stay at 98.6 give or take.. You can get hypothermia anywhere. You can get heatstroke anywhere.
The body likes oxygen.. You can drown in the East and in the West.

If ACLS cant arrive in eight minutes you are dealing with feeding a vegetable for the rest of its life.. But rescuscitation is always worth a try.

 

[alsg]

What does it mean that "the certification is good for 3 years"? Good for what? Does their certification have some kind of significance outside of the organization offering it?

My local canoe club offered a 90 minute, on-line wilderness first aid lecture conducted by a guy from one of the big wilderness first aid organizations. Not saying it is the same thing being offered here. It was in my opinion pretty basic. Covered what's good to have in your first aid kit and when to use it. It was free to club members. Better than nothing but in my opinion in no way a substitute for hands-on, in-person first aid training. It's one thing to know in theory how to do CPR or make a sling or tie a tourniquet to stop bleeding or use a splint to stabilize a break, but doing it on a dummy or a live person pretending to have an injury is a totally different experience.

 

[JohnSand]

My first aid training was in the USCG, and in police departments. I haven't taken a course since. I think you can learn a lot in an online course, and it's way better than not taking any course. At sea on a sailboat my first aid kit assumes the probability of rescue within a few hours if necessary, we're rarely out of helicopter range. I divide injuries into three groups: those we can treat and keep sailing; those we can treat but need to head for port immediately; and those requiring evacuation. If you will be out of cell phone range for an extended period of time, consider other means of summoning assistance.
Every bit of preparation helps.

 

[UCanoe_2]

Thanks, everybody. I received pretty consistent comments across three forums. Online training is better than nothing, but there is no substitute for hands-on. I think I will take the online class just as a refresher, and to report back to the safety committee. Maybe the safety committee could take the online training and then have hands-on practice with each other as patients.

FWIW, Survival Med says their online WFA training is accepted by is accepted by "the National Association of Search and Rescue (NASAR), the National Park Service, the U.S. Forest Service, the American Canoe Association," and other organizations. Accepted for what, I'm not sure. It could be accepted for some level of recertification. It's also recognized by the University of Utah for credit toward their Associate in Wilderness Medicine program, so not entirely useless.

Good suggestion about asking SOLO (which has an instructor nearby) for a discount for a non-profit organization. Can't hurt to ask. I don't feel I would be qualified in terms of practical experience to get trained as an instructor. My wife is a retired RN and former CPR instructor -- she would be qualified. I'll have to figure out how to persuade her to do it.

The "deer in the headlights" response of untrained bystanders is a real consideration. We were once on a family outing to a concert when my aunt tripped and fell, hitting her head. This should have been a low-risk environment, but suddenly we had an elderly woman on the ground with a traumatic brain injury. My mom and dad were clueless. Fortunately my wife and I knew to stabilize her C-spine, and to roll her on her side when she vomited. The outcome was still long term disability, but I like to think we prevented an even worse outcome.

 

[ppine]

Knowledge is power. It adds a measure of safety. Most people are in denial about safety in the remote outdoors.

The best thing you can do is be as careful as possible and not need help. When in doubt portage. Don't leave axes lying around if people are drinking. PFD, dress for immersion, practice rescues, etc.

I have been hurt badly in the outdoors. I ran into a mountain lion once while riding my saddle mule. He bucked me off and broke my femur in the saddle. It was a remote area. A lot of people tried to help on a trail ride. It took quite awhile to find a phone signal. Then we learned there were no helicopters available in remote eastern Oregon. Let that sink in. No helicopters.

I was hauled out of the woods with a cardboard splint that did no good. My friend drove me 90 miles on dirt roads and cattle guards to a ranch air strip and a fixed wing plane with EMTs. First morphine was about 8 hours out. It took all day to get to a hospital in Bend. I had an operation and got a titanium rod in my femur with power tools. It took several years to recover from and I am still carrying the rod, screws and a bolt in my hip.

Our trail riding club of over 100 members, got a sat phone after that experience. Do not have a false sense of security about getting help. It may be a long ways away and many hours from your situation. Be careful out there.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

What does it mean that "the certification is good for 3 years"? Good for what? Does their certification have some kind of significance outside of the organization offering it?

I'm not the OP, but I know that organizations that give courses on various subjects will only certify that you are current in that subject for a certain period of time. Driver safety training, to get lower insurance rates, is an example outside the first aid field. Then, there are many organizations that won't allow people to be trainers, instructors, rescuers, etc., unless your certification is current. The ACA is like that for canoe instructors.

 

[UCanoe_2]

ppine, I am glad you made it through your ordeal and are "back in the saddle again." (Couldn't resist some goofy humor.)

You raise an excellent point: in addition to first aid skills and supplies, communication is vital. Even in settled areas, there are places without cell phone service. Rivers are always at low places in the terrain, so there is often surrounding high ground that can block a signal. I think I will invest in a Zoleo next time REI puts them on sale.

 

[Mason]

I'd like to add that hands-on training is enormously helpful. I had a "Mountaineering First Aid" course in 1981. I got to use that training 18 years later when I broke my neck skiing in the backcountry--I remembered all that I had practiced, and I was nicely setup when the heli came by directing my ski partner on the exact actions I had practiced. I've also done a lot of snow avalanche training, and actually looking for someone buried, with your own timer ticking, is immensely helpful. The same can be said for swiftwater rescue (since this is a paddling site!). I've had WFR a couple of times, and what sticks is what I actually had my hands on. If you're responsible for others, do as much as you can, and don't limit it to online only--try to get more.

 

[yknpdlr]

As a licensed wilderness guide, A SAR crew boss, and a BSA high adventure trek leader guide instructor, I have needed to be certified and maintain currency in WFA for many years. One thing about being recognized as legally current in New York State... even though many of the certifying agencies say their training is good for two years, this state only officially recognizes just the first year since being trained or refreshed. Lifeguards, for example, wishing to work at state operated facilities need to know that. Luckily I have never needed to apply any advanced training in reality, other than caring for very simple injuries on myself or others in remote locations. But the knowledge is helpful when simulating incidents to certify others during training events.

 

[alsg]

I'm not the OP, but I know that organizations that give courses on various subjects will only certify that you are current in that subject for a certain period of time. Driver safety training, to get lower insurance rates, is an example outside the first aid field. Then, there are many organizations that won't allow people to be trainers, instructors, rescuers, etc., unless your certification is current. The ACA is like that for canoe instructors.

Of course. The question is who accepts this certification and for what purposes?

 

[Mason]

Of course. The question is who accepts this certification and for what purposes?

Lots of guide services, as well as SAR require certification, and it must be current/up to date. Some are pretty much the standard for the industry. It helps ensure the safety of their clients/patients as well as provide additional defense for litigation should something happen.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

What does it mean that "the certification is good for 3 years"? Good for what? Does their certification have some kind of significance outside of the organization offering it?

The question is who accepts this certification and for what purposes?

Ah so, Al, is your question who accepts for a three year period THIS particular online first aid course linked by UCanoe2?

Research by an unemplo . . . uh . . . retired person into that site's FAQ reveals this:

"Survival Med’s Wilderness First Aid certification is accepted by the National Association of Search and Rescue (NASAR), the National Park Service, the U.S. Forest Service, the American Canoe Association, many expedition and guide companies, and numerous other national and international organizations, governmental entities and employers."

 

[Gamma1214]

Of course. The question is who accepts this certification and for what purpose?

These days, it seems that everyone requires someone else to sign off that personnel are certified (for pretty much anything they do). I worked in the woods as a professional tree cutter and still needed to get certified by the Nat'l Park Svc in order to clear trails (of deadfalls, for goodness sakes!) as a volunteer for the North Country Trail Assoc.

As it turned out, I had several years' experience on the (very knowledgeable) instructor but I still needed his signature before I could pull a cord on the trail. It's all about CYA and we live in a VERY litigious society.

Personally, I'll most likely take the course... it's not very hard to get $35 worth of information at today's prices. Besides, I'll be hoping I never need the training or the certification.

 

[alsg]

Ah so, Al, is your question who accepts for a three year period THIS particular online first aid course linked by UCanoe2?

Research by an unemplo . . . uh . . . retired person into that site's FAQ reveals this:

"Survival Med’s Wilderness First Aid certification is accepted by the National Association of Search and Rescue (NASAR), the National Park Service, the U.S. Forest Service, the American Canoe Association, many expedition and guide companies, and numerous other national and international organizations, governmental entities and employers."

That was the first half of the question. Also curious for what purpose.

My best guess is these classes qualify you under some jurisdictions' Good Samaritan Laws. These laws generally protect people who (1) aren't compensated and (2) act in good faith from being sued for attempting to render first aid.

Some of the Good Samaritan Laws (Cal., Conn., Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maryland, Mississippi, Pennsylvania and Utah based on quick research) specifically immunize volunteers who have Red Cross First Aid certification or any "equivalent" certification that has been approved by some official within the jurisdiction. I'm guessing the NPS and USFS have similar regs but I'm too lazy to look them up.

So, if your goal is not to be sued for administering free wilderness first aid, this on-line class may get the job done. As for making you actually competent to administer wilderness fist aid, however, I'm dubious.

If someone is going to splint me, reduce a fracture or apply a tourniquet, I'd kind of prefer it if they had at least practiced it on a dummy before doing it to THIS dummy. Even lengthy in-person classes and practice on dummies or actors pretending to have injuries doesn't fully prepare one for dealing with a real human in major pain/distress. At least that was my experience as a National Ski Patrol member. The first real broken leg I had to deal with was a lot harder to splint than when I was working on actors.

 

[UCanoe_2]

Al, the Virginia Good Samaritan law protects "any person." It does not require training to render volunteer assistance in an emergency. https://law.lis.virginia.gov/vacode/title8.01/chapter3/section8.01-225/ Paid professionals are held to a higher standard. There are specific provisions in the law for school employees, ski patrollers, etc. that do not apply to our organization.

That said, it makes sense for us to be the best Good Samaritans we can be. My question is what training is feasible for volunteers with a low budget non-profit to obtain, for the purposes of picking up trash or leading trips on a small Class I-II river. The online training appears to meet a minimum standard. I do agree that hands-on practice is best and extremely important, and I'm a big fan of the SOLO training I took many years ago. Folks on another forum have suggested asking the local fire department or schools if we could participate in their classes, hopefully at no cost. I will look into these options also.