Alchohol

[Black_Fly]

I'm considering moving away from my MRS Dragonfly to an alchohol burner for my solo stove. This would eliminate the 2nd stove I've been carrying. I have no idea about the burn rate of this fuel. Any information about the efficiency of alchohol burners would be helpful. I've been carrying one liter bottle of fuel for a 2 week trip along with the two stoves, using the Dragonfly when weather dictates. I'm also considering a more compact, lighter twig stove, but can't decide which one. The Solo Titan Stove works great and is very durable. Any help with folding stove choices would also be appreciated. Thanks.

PS - sorry if you thought this post was about booze and are now disappointed. Feel free to discuss booze options if desired. Too bad they can't dehydrate tequila, eh?

 

[Bothwell Voyageur]

Alcohol; you can have hot or you can have frugal but you can't have both!

get a cone system if you are a one pan guy.

watch out for fuel consumption rates listed using ethanol. It burns hotter so less is needed I generally budget 1 oz of methyl hydrate (methanol) per two cups of water under real world conditions. If I come back with some fuel left I'm not worried.

You could always check the twig stoves I make on canoepaddler.net

 

[Guest]

I tried an alcohol stove. it burned way too much fuel-a lot to carry. I hate the noise fuel stoves make! I am real satisfied with my Emberlit Folding titanium twig stove. I take extra cheap military fuel tabs in case I can't find fuel or can't get a wood fire going-never happened.

 

[Alan Gage]

I cook over a twig stove almost exclusively. On my last long trip (42 days) the only fuel stove I brought was an alcohol stove with about 8 ounces of fuel. I didn't use it until 30 days into the trip. After a prolonged stretch of cold and rainy weather I broke down and started cooking with alcohol in my tent opening on occasion. I still had fuel left at the end of the trip. I like the simplicity and quietness of the alcohol stove (plus they can work in conjunction with many twig stoves) but I don't know if there's much of a weight/bulk savings as opposed to bringing a small MSR type stove with a similar amount of fuel.

I've never really kept track of fuel usage but Bothwell Voyageur is probably about right.

The low temperature takes longer to boil water but it's nice for cooking things like bannock or pancakes to keep from burning them.

I've used the Littlbug Jr. solo twig stove extensively and am very happy with it. It packs small, goes together quick and easy, and has a really nice chimney effect that starts easy and burns hot. It nests inside my cooking pot along with my mug.

Bothwell Voyageur also sells some nice twig stoves. I've got the titanium Nomad from him but haven't been on a real trip since I got it so all I've done is use it a few times close to home.

20160811_163 by Alan, on Flickr

20160827_352 by Alan, on Flickr

Alan

 

[OCDave]

The utility of alcohol varies widely depending upon ambient temps, design of your stove, size of you pot ect,. My preferred alcohol stove, a MiniBull BIOS (a rolled aluminum beer can design), will heat 2 cups water from room temp (70*F) to a rolling boil in 5 minutes in a covered 12 cm IMUSA cup with no wind at 70ish degrees ambient temp. If I use 20mL of the yellow HEET the stove will start to putter out around 6 minutes. Vary your fuel- Red Heet, Mineral Spirits, Brake Fluid ect; Vary your pot, add wind or cooler temps and boil times and fuel consumption will vary as well.

WIth the light weight and efficiency of the many small canister stoves available, there is hardly any benefit of alcohol from a weight perspective. In addition, canister stoves like the MSR Pocket Rocket 2 or Primus Classic Trail stove are adjustable to allow simmering and real cooking rather than limiting one to simply boiling water.

You mention carrying a second stove. Why? What is that stove? Would that stove become your primary stove wth the alcohol stove becomeing an alternate?

When Solo, I prefer my MSR Micro Rocket.
With a group of 2-4 the Primus Classic Trail is perfect.
With Larger groups or winter temps, my MSR Whisperlight Universal is my "Go To" stove.
I will cook over fire when abble but have never carried a twig stove for that pupose.
I have half-a-dozen alcohol stoves but, never use them.

 

[wgiles]

The heat of combustion by weight of Ethanol is about 30% greater than that of Methanol, so Ethanol is the preferred fuel except at low temperatures. Wasted fuel is an issue with alcohol stoves, since you can't easily just turn them off and most don't have a good way to preserve unused fuel. I use alcohol stoves, canister stoves, white gas stoves and twig stoves. Each has some merits and each has some drawbacks. My alcohol stove is lightweight and simple, but I don't use it for anything other than boiling water. I have to admit that, when out in the woods, I don't really want to cook, but just heat something up and go.

 

[goonstroke]

... Vary your fuel- Red Heet, Mineral Spirits, Brake Fluid ect;

I would need a lot of dehydrated tequila before I'd be ready for Brake Fluid Bannock.

 

[OCDave]

I would need a lot of dehydrated tequila before I'd be ready for Brake Fluid Bannock.

Yeah, sorry about that. What I intended to reference was Airbrake antifreeze: pretty much straight up methanol.

 

[frozentripper]

I can't see the need for bringing in fuel when there is natural fuel available for a twig stove almost everywhere and it is being produced and replenished in nature constantly. Maybe an alcohol stove is faster and more convenient... OTOH I haven't been encouraged by the boil times. My little twig stove boils a liter in about 7-8 minutes, alcohol seemed to take longer.

 

[yknpdlr]

For a long time i would impress boy scouts with burning "water". I used denatured alcohol in my trangia (it burned cleaner than methanol). Turns out that adding 10% water made ethanol burn even cleaner. So I would take a drink from my water filled nalgene bottle and then demonstrate pouring a small amount into my trangia burner as "fuel" before lighting it. It was a lot of fun to prove that I was drinking only pure water and that it burned.

I still like my alcohol burners in many forms and configurations, but also like to use a twig/pine cone burning Kelly Kettle for quickly boiling a few cups of water. Turns out a canister stove is fast and quite convenient so sometimes use one of those too.

 

[Black_Fly]

Sounds like I'd be disappointed on some cold, wind swept rock someday when i need some strong coffee and my twig stove won't do it. Guess the Dragonfly will remain part of my kit.

Does anyone have a good method for quickly cleaning soot off pots, besides sand and elbow grease?

 

[yknpdlr]

Does anyone have a good method for quickly cleaning soot off pots, besides sand and elbow grease?

In scouts we would pre-coat the bottom to the pot with liquid dish detergent before putting it on the fire. After cooking it easily cleaned off, soot and all.

 

[Guest]

If I was on a cold rock with no wood, I would just lite one or two of the fuel tabs in my twigg stove for that unlikely occasion. WHO cleans pots??

 

[Odyssey]

Sounds like I'd be disappointed on some cold, wind swept rock someday when i need some strong coffee and my twig stove won't do it. Guess the Dragonfly will remain part of my kit.

Does anyone have a good method for quickly cleaning soot off pots, besides sand and elbow grease?

Wind doesn't affect twiggies any more than it does fuelies in my experience. Many white gas and alcohol stoves work well when you deploy a windscreen of some kind. In a pinch I use cooking foil folded up. A section of my Littlbug twig stove is ideal for this if it is not being used. My twig stove is basically a tubular chimney with side ports on one side at the bottom. I just turn the stove with these ports to draw just the right amount of wind to feed the fire. Not too much not too little. Easy and sensible. No directions needed. If the wind is blowing so hard as to trouble whichever stove you've chosen you'd be better off blaming the site location than the stove. (But I know you were just kidding.) For wind management I site the chosen stove in the lee of my tarp, a rock or two, a pack or barrel, or myself seated comfortably on the ground. My favourite twig location is actually within the rock fire ring in camp, but sometimes I've relocated to a nice slab of lakeside granite with a view. Incidentally my twig stove also accommodates an alcohol burner placed within, so the two make good travel companions.
Thanks for the dish soap suggestion everyone, I might try it. I've never found it any problem just strolling on down to the water's edge holding the pots by their clean bail handles and giving them a scour. Sand and grit do work, but we always include a small plastic scrub pad in our kit. It rarely takes more than a brief swipe with pad and a microfibre cloth. No elbow grease involved. The pots nest in a cozy with draw cord anyway so I'm not overly bothered about transferring soot anywhere. But I do like clean stuff so they're usually sparkly good enough so I'm usually a happy clean camper. I didn't realize how fussy I was about this until our son and d-i-l returned our pots in a sooty state. I was pissed..way more than if the fly were damp or a tent peg missing, because really, how hard is it to clean pots?!

 

[Alan Gage]

WHO cleans pots??

My thoughts too.

Alan

 

[yknpdlr]

Caution. If you try the dish detergent coating method on your pot (which does work really well), please do not take it down to the water's edge to wash it in sand. Bring a handful of wet sand up well away from the water area first to do your washing. it will be soapy. Thanks.

 

[Black_Fly]

If I was on a cold rock with no wood, I would just lite one or two of the fuel tabs in my twigg stove for that unlikely occasion. WHO cleans pots??

WHY would you put sooty pots back in your pack to leave black on everything it touches? I've heard of the detergent thing, not sure it's a LNT method though.

 

[yknpdlr]

I've heard of the detergent thing, not sure it's a LNT method though.

You could just have an appropriate sized small garbage bag or another dedicated stuff sack for dirty pots. Then, with soap coating on or not, take them home to properly wash off the soot and soap.

 

[Alan Gage]

WHY would you put sooty pots back in your pack to leave black on everything it touches?

Pots and pans go in their own stuff sack. Never had the soot get on anything.

Alan

 

[Bothwell Voyageur]

Do folk not use a bag to store their pots in their pack? They are easy to make if your post don't come with one. If I'm using a nesting set each pot has its own separate bag, keeps things clean and stops things rattling