site member activity

[stripperguy]

Glenn,
Is there any way you can (in your copious free time) post some data on member activity levels?
Gamma mentioned in the "how old are you" poll that there seems to be less activity than the previous poll, despite a considerable rise in membership.
I am wondering how the rising membership correlates to numbers of posts.
Do 10% of us provide 80% of the content?
Are there members that join and submit a single post, then never post again?
Is this site driven by a few, prolific members?
Without naming names, can you readily determine the posting/number of members distibution?

 

[Benson Gray]

I'm not Glenn and don't have access to the administrative side of this forum but XenForo does provide some limited statistics as shown below from the similar WCHA forums (https://forums.wcha.org/). The short answer is yes, a very limited number of members provide most of the content and activity in forums like this.

Benson

 

[recped]

Glenn,

Do 10% of us provide 80% of the content?

My guess is that your numbers should be 5% of registered users provide 95% of the content.

I'm on many different boards, on most of them I would estimate that only 2% of registered users make more than 1 post per year with 75% never posting at all. Some of these boards have over 100,000 registered users.

Note: The statistics above are not based on fact, they are based on "I feel it in my bones".

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

Glenn,
Is there any way you can (in your copious free time) post some data on member activity levels?
Gamma mentioned in the "how old are you" poll that there seems to be less activity than the previous poll, despite a considerable rise in membership.
I am wondering how the rising membership correlates to numbers of posts.
Do 10% of us provide 80% of the content?
Are there members that join and submit a single post, then never post again?
Is this site driven by a few, prolific members?
Without naming names, can you readily determine the posting/number of members distibution?

Post counts are not particularly accurate because deleted spam posts are counted, and we've been inundated with them almost daily for several months. I've taken aggressive steps to stop that over the past two days, which will also make legitimate registrations a bit more difficult.

We have tripled our membership since September 2021 when I took over and migrated this site from vBulletin to Xenforo. We certainly have significantly increasing numbers of readers and lurkers, but I don't have tools to track numbers of those. I'd estimate that 95+% of new members never post or start threads, even though most are likely reading new and archived threads. Therefore, I'd estimate that our actual, legitimate, daily posting activity has increased only modestly compared to our registration increases since 2021.

BY FAR, posting activity per day is MOST strongly correlated with thread starts per day. Every new thread start a day will jump post counts up by five to ten posts that day and for a period of three to five days thereafter. Many days no new threads are started, and we've probably averaged about three thread starts a day for years.

If no one started threads, this site (and any discussion site) would DIE! This is not rocket science: A discussion site, by definition, requires someone to start the discussions. Many active posters here never or rarely start new threads and only post in newly-started threads. Therefore, regarding thread starters, we have a whole lot of takers but comparatively few givers. Because of this, I feel obligated (and actually like to) start many threads on this site. Some work, some don't.

No one needs to take a trip, build a canoe, or buy gear just to start a conversation. It's easy — and folks here will converse about just about anything, sometimes at surprising lengths. Again, some topics work well, some don't, and some are in between.

In summary, I'd say we have a small core of consistent thread starters, a larger and slowly growing core of regular posters (but most of whom only post in newly-started threads), and a gigantic number of daily lurkers and thread readers.

I certainly hope a lot of all of them will financially contribute to the first fund raiser in three years, which will begin on November 1, 2026. This site will also die without voluntary financial support from posters and readers alike.

 

[dutchlennart]

This seems to be the most active canoeing forum now. Sadly i guess much happens on other platform that i refuse to be part of.
Some fora have been slowing down for years. Many others are gone.
i hope this will stay a while.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

Gamma mentioned in the "how old are you" poll that there seems to be less activity than the previous poll, despite a considerable rise in membership.

One thing obvious from the 2016 age poll vs. the 2026 poll is that, in ten years, the modal age here has jumped from the 50s, right over the 60s, and now into the 70s. Combine that with the obvious fact that kayak sales have significantly outpaced canoe sales for the past 40 years, and one can reach the logical conclusion that the number of canoe discussion enthusiasts in the world are aging out faster than they are being replaced.

While I believe CTN is the most fully-featured and active open canoe site on the internet now and is still growing, that is probably coming at the expense of canoe sites that are now defunct or those that remain but are shrinking. It doesn't require Nostradamus to prophesy that the total number of canoe forum posts is likely in decline worldwide. However, the open canoe niche will always be there, and I hope this site can serve and survive in that niche for a long time.

Like most institutions and organizations in Darwinian life, success simply requires sufficient collective effort — by owners, administrators, moderators, thread starters, and posters — to outperform the competition.

 

[M Clemens]

I remember asking this question back in 2020 in the old forum, which displayed the active user count. It wasn't clear how it was calculated, but seemed to indicate that a minority of members generate the new threads.

 

[Benson Gray]

the old forum, which displayed the active user count

This is a feature of vBulletin which has not been replicated under XenForo in the same way. The WoodenBoat forum is still running vBulletin and their statistics are shown below for comparison.



The page at https://forum.vbulletin.com/forum/v...bleshooting/180642-question-on-active-members indicates that the administrator sets an "Active Members Time Cut-Off to determine who is active." The "Users active" statistic shown in my previous message is a similar XenForo metric which appears to only be available on the administrative pages.

Benson

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

the old [vBulletin] forum, which displayed the active user count

The "Users active" statistic [in Xenforo]

Here is a graph showing the average number of daily "users active" each month from our migration onto Xenforo in August 30, 2021, through today:



The highest actual daily total was 185 active users on February 19, 2025.

What constitutes an "active user" each day is a bit murky. "Users" only includes logged-in registered members, not logged-off members, unregistered guests, lurkers or bots. "Active" seems to mean that the logged-in registered member clicked on the site to read a post or make a post. The tools can't measure how many logged-off members, unregistered guests, or human lurkers are reading posts, but my guess is that they far outnumber the "active users" each day.

I doubt "active users" can be meaningfully correlated between vBulletin and Xenforo because the data are calculated over different time spans in each platform's control program and the definitions are likely different.

In any event, the trend line of "active users" each day has been on an upward slope over the almost-five-year life of our Xenforo platform, although leveling off the past year or so.

 

[Pseudonym]

Since meeting Glenn last year, I have gained a little insight into the MASSIVE amount of work that goes into administering and moderating this site, every single day. We're very lucky Glenn and Alan are willing to do so for our benefit. As always, a sincere thanks to them!

 

[Benson Gray]

one can reach the logical conclusion that the number of canoe discussion enthusiasts in the world are aging out faster than they are being replaced

This may be true but we also need to consider the variety of places where these discussions occur. The WCHA forum is similar to this one in many ways with a peak of 184 active users on May 7th, 2024. However, it also has a corresponding Facebook group known as the Fans of the WCHA which currently has 14,814 members. Facebook statistics are difficult to track past 60 days but this group had a peak of 85 posts and comments on April 3rd followed by another peak of 28,795 views on April 5th. A single message there on January 27th generated 107 comments, 1210 likes, and had over 78,811 views by February 14th. I enjoy canoes and forums but we are all somewhat archaic. The rec.boats.paddle newsgroup once had a huge following with 68,911 conversations but has nothing now. Social media can be annoying but attracts a much larger audience today. It won't last forever.

Benson

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

one can reach the logical conclusion that the number of canoe discussion enthusiasts in the world are aging out faster than they are being replaced.

This may be true but we also need to consider the variety of places where these discussions occur. . . . Facebook group . . . . Social media can be annoying but has a much larger audience today.

I should have made clearer in this thread and the age poll thread, where I said something similar, and in all places where I have said similar things in the past, that when I refer to the decline in "canoe discussion" sites or "canoe discussion" enthusiasts or posters, I am excluding all social media platforms. I'm speaking about the original, pre-social-media discussion platforms, beginning with BBS bulletin boards, message boards, and discussion boards like this one — where posters type and discuss things often at great length, where threaded topics are organized into different subject matter forums, and where people return year-after-year to those forums as reference and informational sources.

I believe those types of discussion platforms have been declining for virtually all subject areas, certainly including canoeing. The primary reason for this, as an overall matter, is the availability of social media for short, quick, grammar-and-punctuation-be-danged, drive-by comments and pictures. Overwhelmingly using phones, which have tiny keyboards not conducive to extended typing.

Old-timey canoe discussion boards, like this one, have certainly been significantly impacted by the presence of social media, but I'm hypothesizing that there are two other forces also at play: open canoes are declining percentagewise as the vehicle for paddle sports, and the universe of open canoeists is aging out faster than it is being replaced.

I would never post something this length on Facebook or X or any other so-called social medium, even if I frequented such places, and certainly not on a phone.

I also believe that relative paucity of thread starters, about which I occasionally rail here, is caused in significant part by modern technology and attitudes. Pre-geezer folks increasingly prefer to communicate via portable devices such as phones and small tablets, rather than by full-keyboard computers; they have decreasing attention spans; they would rather be spoon-fed bites of dubious, second- or third-hand information, rather than personally researching megabytes of information from original sources; and hence they are increasingly averse to engaging in any sort of expository or creative writing at length.

 

[Benson Gray]

that relative paucity of thread starters

You may want to be careful what you wish for. The WoodenBoat forum faced this and some related issues many years ago. They created a section of their forum called "The Bilge" for the discussion of non-boat related topics including politics. This section is now about three times the size of all their other forums combined and is a ongoing headache for their moderator.

Benson

 

[Alan Gage]

You may want to be careful what you wish for. The WoodenBoat forum faced this and some related issues many years ago. They created a section of their forum called "The Bilge" for the discussion of non-boat related topics including politics. This section is now about three times the size of all their other forums combined and is a ongoing headache for their moderator.

Benson

I was part of a forum for automotive professionals about 25 years ago and they had a similar forum. The 'open' forum was eventually shut down because, despite having nothing to do with the intent of the site, it by far created the most hard feelings between members and caused the most work and stress for the site administrators. Many members were only active in that sub forum and none of the others.

Alan

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

You may want to be careful what you wish for. The WoodenBoat forum faced this and some related issues many years ago. They created a section of their forum called "The Bilge" for the discussion of non-boat related topics including politics. This section is now about three times the size of all their other forums combined and is a ongoing headache for their moderator.

We don't have an off-topic forum here, and won't under my administration. Politics is strictly forbidden by the rules. On the other hand, I don't mind an occasional tangent or some thread drift when a thread topic seems to be exhausted. I'm not sure I've ever locked a thread for that reason. Alan exercises his own judgment on these matters and I don't second-guess him.

I decry the lack of on-topic thread starts, and we have so many broad categories of topical forums. It just puzzles me that many members frequently make excellent contributions in replying to threads but so infrequently start threads themselves. It often reminds me of my youth when folks wanted to and would go on dates but were afraid to ask for one. Girls, especially, would always wait to be asked. Is it still that way? Does anyone date another human being these days? Do they do anything on dates other than look at their phones?

See, topics are so easy to think of. Oh . . . I'm off topic. I need moderation.

 

[recped]

I decry the lack of on-topic thread starts, and we have so many broad categories of topical forums. It just puzzles me that many members frequently make excellent contributions in replying to threads but so infrequently start threads themselves.

You talkin' to me?

You might be because in the 9 years I've been here I have only started 9 threads.

This is not a CTN thing, I am on about a dozen boards on a regular (daily) basis (only 2 are canoe related), I rarely start threads on any of them.

I'll try to do better, maybe start a few "paddling with chickens" threads!

 

[Steve in Idaho]

Politics is strictly forbidden by the rules.

I have the same rule on group trips of any kind. It's interesting that some individuals can't abide by it, but take offense when politics are discussed in other settings.

Anyway, I consider this place a virtual group trip, and appreciate that rule.