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Death in the Wilderness: What do you do with the body?
- Thread starter Glenn MacGrady
- Start date
So far, the best suggestion I have seen is to sink the body, mark the spot and go to the takeout area. It will slow decomposition and allow the proper authorities time to return and conduct an investigation.
I love the scene in "Dead Man", where the dying Johnny Depp gets pushed off into the mist in a canoe. Wonderful movie (with Neil Young soundtrack!).
The scenario is not entirely hypothetical. I have been invited as a solo paddler to accompany a tandem team on such a trip. We are all old, so one of us could die.
Let me add some more details for those who want to keep playing along in this serious exercise.
Realistically, if two people arrive back from a canoe trip and claim the third person died, the two will be suspected by the police of murder. The only way to clear yourself will be to retrieve the body for autopsy. You must keep this reality in mind.
Hypothetically, it is the solo canoeist who died halfway through a four mile uncleared, bushwack portage in the boreal forest. You are at or above the arctic circle -- somewhere where it's warm during the day but can still get close to freezing some nights. At the end of this portage is a river that will take you all the way to the take-out in 15 days at normal paddling speed. However, the river has several long portages around long rapids. But you don't know how many because you have no guidebook, no satellite or aerial photos, and only a crude map. No GPS.
Do you leave the body on the portage trail or lug it to the river edge? Then what do you do. Bury? How? Do you have a shovel on a canoe trip?
To add a next step of complexity, after you have made your firm decision either to take the body out or leave it, your tandem partner declares that he or she is firmly of the opposite opinion. For example, you have decided to leave the body, but your tandem partner says, "Nope. I'm not leaving our beloved friend to rot and get accused of murder. I'm going to put the body in the tandem and paddle away. You take the solo canoe. Or, let's put the body in the solo canoe and tow it with the tandem. I insist." What do YOU do?
P.S. I haven't read those books. What did they do?
Let me add some more details for those who want to keep playing along in this serious exercise.
Realistically, if two people arrive back from a canoe trip and claim the third person died, the two will be suspected by the police of murder. The only way to clear yourself will be to retrieve the body for autopsy. You must keep this reality in mind.
Hypothetically, it is the solo canoeist who died halfway through a four mile uncleared, bushwack portage in the boreal forest. You are at or above the arctic circle -- somewhere where it's warm during the day but can still get close to freezing some nights. At the end of this portage is a river that will take you all the way to the take-out in 15 days at normal paddling speed. However, the river has several long portages around long rapids. But you don't know how many because you have no guidebook, no satellite or aerial photos, and only a crude map. No GPS.
Do you leave the body on the portage trail or lug it to the river edge? Then what do you do. Bury? How? Do you have a shovel on a canoe trip?
To add a next step of complexity, after you have made your firm decision either to take the body out or leave it, your tandem partner declares that he or she is firmly of the opposite opinion. For example, you have decided to leave the body, but your tandem partner says, "Nope. I'm not leaving our beloved friend to rot and get accused of murder. I'm going to put the body in the tandem and paddle away. You take the solo canoe. Or, let's put the body in the solo canoe and tow it with the tandem. I insist." What do YOU do?
P.S. I haven't read those books. What did they do?
Glenn,
After a capsize on the Dubawnt River, Art Moffat died of hypothermia. The surviving group members were nearly out of food, with winter approaching. They placed Moffat’s body under an upturned canoe, and paddled for days (can’t remember how many, but they had a long way to go) as fast as they could to Baker Lake, arriving on the day that they ran out of food.
After a capsize on the Dubawnt River, Art Moffat died of hypothermia. The surviving group members were nearly out of food, with winter approaching. They placed Moffat’s body under an upturned canoe, and paddled for days (can’t remember how many, but they had a long way to go) as fast as they could to Baker Lake, arriving on the day that they ran out of food.
G
Guest
Guest
I’m probably not lugging a dead body across the remaining 2 miles of uncleared bushwack. I’d leave it somewhere along the portage trail and mark the location as best I could, possibly using the solo canoe as partial cover. I do not carry a shovel big enough to dig a sufficient deep hole, so full burial 5 feet deep isn’t going to happen and critters are probably getting at it no matter what.
I would not be on a rigorous trip with someone so boneheaded that they would consider toting a dead, soon to be decaying meat sack for two weeks in the canoe and somehow schleping it across portages as parts fell off. The stench alone would be unbearable long before the 2 weeks were up.
Same for someone opining that we should put the body in the solo and freaking tow it the rest of the way out. That person has never towed a canoe behind a canoe very far, and there are rapids and more portages ahead. That would be a recipe for disaster.
I can say “I would not be on a rigorous trip with someone so boneheaded” because I will not do even an easy weekend trip with someone I’ve not at least day paddled with, and won’t do a long, hard trip without first having done a weekender or two.
I don’t care what they have done or their acclaimed bona fides; beyond their paddling and tripping skill set I need to know how well our styles and personalities mesh. Or don’t mesh. I’ve made that mistake before, and won’t do so again.
What to do with the solo canoe, even if both living paddlers are of a mind to continue to paddle out, leaving the body behind, raises an interesting theoretical question. Depending on the solo-ability of the tandem, the surviving paddler’s skills and the anticipated conditions ahead I might consider taking both canoes, for a variety of two-boat safety reasons.
*How well do you know these folks? Have you paddled and tripped with them before?
Why does it matter which paddler died? Either way the remaining two paddlers will utilize the tandem and leave the solo
Where did you find the boreal forest at or above the arctic circle?
You need to clarify if we're actually at the arctic circle (which should be the tundra) or if we're in the boreal forest.
If we came to loggerheads on this decision then I'd suggest they stay with the body, with their share of food and shelter, while I push on with the solo canoe and the remaining food and shelter. You did say earlier we were well provisioned so this shouldn't be a problem, especially since dead men don't eat or require shelter. If they stay with the body the whole time then great. If they regret their decision after a few days (or if something happens to me and no rescue arrives) they can start working downriver themselves.
Alan
Sorry, this isn't Weekend at Bernie's! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weekend_at_Bernie's
Even if the nights are freezing cold, a dead body at 15 days is going to be decomposing.
It is hard to see how even 2 able-bodied young guys will haul a dead guy around with them for 15 days in these circumstances (difficult portages).
If the scenario is two old, not totally able-bodied guys trying to haul a dead guy, it gets ever more unlikely.
And if the two old survivors strongly disagree about what's to be done with the body and one insists on trying to haul the dead guy alone, there will likely be 2 dead old guys before they reach civilization.
Leaving the body and covering it with whatever can easily be scrounged, including the canoe, is the only realistic option in the scenario given.
The simple solution today is to bring a PLB or sat messenger like the Zoleo, In Reach or Spot. A guy gets sick or croaks, push the button, Max. https://youtu.be/R3Igz5SfBCE?t=68
Even if the nights are freezing cold, a dead body at 15 days is going to be decomposing.
It is hard to see how even 2 able-bodied young guys will haul a dead guy around with them for 15 days in these circumstances (difficult portages).
If the scenario is two old, not totally able-bodied guys trying to haul a dead guy, it gets ever more unlikely.
And if the two old survivors strongly disagree about what's to be done with the body and one insists on trying to haul the dead guy alone, there will likely be 2 dead old guys before they reach civilization.
Leaving the body and covering it with whatever can easily be scrounged, including the canoe, is the only realistic option in the scenario given.
The simple solution today is to bring a PLB or sat messenger like the Zoleo, In Reach or Spot. A guy gets sick or croaks, push the button, Max. https://youtu.be/R3Igz5SfBCE?t=68
Ever read "The cremation of Sam McGee?"
https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/45081/the-cremation-of-sam-mcgee
There are strange things done in the midnight sun
By the men who moil for gold;
The Arctic trails have their secret tales
That would make your blood run cold;
The Northern Lights have seen queer sights,
But the queerest they ever did see
Was that night on the marge of Lake Lebarge
I cremated Sam McGee.
https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/45081/the-cremation-of-sam-mcgee
There are strange things done in the midnight sun
By the men who moil for gold;
The Arctic trails have their secret tales
That would make your blood run cold;
The Northern Lights have seen queer sights,
But the queerest they ever did see
Was that night on the marge of Lake Lebarge
I cremated Sam McGee.
Properly field dressing the carcass will help with the weight if it is decided to take the body out.
Glenn--just found a used copy--well worth reading
https://www.betterworldbooks.com/pr...-Tragedy-in-the-Canadian-Arctic-9781556438820
https://www.betterworldbooks.com/pr...-Tragedy-in-the-Canadian-Arctic-9781556438820
Drying thin strips even better.
Despite the plethora of unlikely what-ifs in the original situation I will skip past them avoiding the obvious dramedy (which would be a shame) and on to Day 1.
Day 1 : Deal with whatever emergency has just taken place, securing gear and making survivors safe. Set up camp and settled down to a layover day. Might as well, who was in a dang hurry anyway? Pitch the tents with the bedding, prep and get a fire going. By now nerves and emotions are less raw. Perhaps.
Does our friend-tripper have a name? Let's call him/her Jamie for convenience. If Jamie is well and truly gone and shaken off this mortal coil then it's best to make ourselves comfortable, Jamie too, and do what we all would want. Pay our respects. Say some prayers, shed some tears, make an offering, propose a toast and usher Jamie's spirit on to the next great adventure. Let the bad stuff go. Hold onto the good.
Time to brew a pail of tea and get a meal started. When that's underway and taken care of let's make a shroud for Jamie. There's a spare sleeping bag and maybe a tent too. Whatever material is at hand. How about a spare tarp? Is there a tent nobody liked? Let's choose something durable. First check Jamie's pockets! ID. Truck keys. Whatever. And then wrap 'ol Jamie up tight. There must be some paracord or duct tape around to secure this body bundle.
Sun's gone down and stars are coming out (if we're not unlucky). Jamie can sleep the deep sleep wherever we feel comfortable. I'm okay sharing a tent for one night but plans are to leave Jamie behind. We could drag Jamie in the solo over the portages and tow across lakes and down the placid river sections but...it seems safer for all bodies and souls if we continue in tandem. Pitch a spare tent if needs must and entomb Jamie in a final fitting abode. In the shade would be beneficial. There's not a lot we can do about scavengers. A large rock cairn could work. Floating the shrouded member in the solo anchored a distance from shore? Maybe. We can discuss these ideas. As far as debating bringing our 3rd tripper along or not that would depend entirely on the route. Easy drags and tows, then yes. Otherwise no. And if my tandem partner is stubbornly insisting on including this dead weight in the final 15 day trip then they better be ready for the consequences of that choice. I will be begrudgingly included in this endeavour but you will have to listen to me gripe. And swear. But I will work. However I'd wager by Day 18 Jamie would be stashed on a pleasant campsite left behind...in body only.
If someone wanted to split up with one pushing on while the other remained behind with Jamie, I'd call that risky. Smokey fires are noticed in the wilderness but it would take a determined effort to maintain it. Would be wiser IMO to keep together and stay put if itinerary and supplies afforded these change of plans. Wildfires are detected but flyovers might not be assured. If time and supplies were limited I'd suggest a short layover only.
Day 2 or 3 or 4.....: Let the trip continue. Almost the way we all planned it.
ps Having said all this, if the unfortunate soul were an immediate family member of mine Id remain behind. Tend the fire. Keep company. Wait for help. Solo if I had to. I am not always rational.
Day 1 : Deal with whatever emergency has just taken place, securing gear and making survivors safe. Set up camp and settled down to a layover day. Might as well, who was in a dang hurry anyway? Pitch the tents with the bedding, prep and get a fire going. By now nerves and emotions are less raw. Perhaps.
Does our friend-tripper have a name? Let's call him/her Jamie for convenience. If Jamie is well and truly gone and shaken off this mortal coil then it's best to make ourselves comfortable, Jamie too, and do what we all would want. Pay our respects. Say some prayers, shed some tears, make an offering, propose a toast and usher Jamie's spirit on to the next great adventure. Let the bad stuff go. Hold onto the good.
Time to brew a pail of tea and get a meal started. When that's underway and taken care of let's make a shroud for Jamie. There's a spare sleeping bag and maybe a tent too. Whatever material is at hand. How about a spare tarp? Is there a tent nobody liked? Let's choose something durable. First check Jamie's pockets! ID. Truck keys. Whatever. And then wrap 'ol Jamie up tight. There must be some paracord or duct tape around to secure this body bundle.
Sun's gone down and stars are coming out (if we're not unlucky). Jamie can sleep the deep sleep wherever we feel comfortable. I'm okay sharing a tent for one night but plans are to leave Jamie behind. We could drag Jamie in the solo over the portages and tow across lakes and down the placid river sections but...it seems safer for all bodies and souls if we continue in tandem. Pitch a spare tent if needs must and entomb Jamie in a final fitting abode. In the shade would be beneficial. There's not a lot we can do about scavengers. A large rock cairn could work. Floating the shrouded member in the solo anchored a distance from shore? Maybe. We can discuss these ideas. As far as debating bringing our 3rd tripper along or not that would depend entirely on the route. Easy drags and tows, then yes. Otherwise no. And if my tandem partner is stubbornly insisting on including this dead weight in the final 15 day trip then they better be ready for the consequences of that choice. I will be begrudgingly included in this endeavour but you will have to listen to me gripe. And swear. But I will work. However I'd wager by Day 18 Jamie would be stashed on a pleasant campsite left behind...in body only.
If someone wanted to split up with one pushing on while the other remained behind with Jamie, I'd call that risky. Smokey fires are noticed in the wilderness but it would take a determined effort to maintain it. Would be wiser IMO to keep together and stay put if itinerary and supplies afforded these change of plans. Wildfires are detected but flyovers might not be assured. If time and supplies were limited I'd suggest a short layover only.
Day 2 or 3 or 4.....: Let the trip continue. Almost the way we all planned it.
ps Having said all this, if the unfortunate soul were an immediate family member of mine Id remain behind. Tend the fire. Keep company. Wait for help. Solo if I had to. I am not always rational.
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G
Guest
Guest
Maybe secure the ID to the body? Definitely take the truck keys. (Off topic segue; when paddling with a companion and two-vehicle self shuttle we carry each other’s spare keys, for any number of plausible but still un-dead scenarios)
Brad, shrouding the body is one of the most sensible and reasonable steps suggested so far. Bundled up in extra gear and tied tight with extra line the parts and pieces might not be too scattered by the time the body is retrieved weeks later for investigation.
I would be hesitant to submerge/sink Jaime for fear that the lines, knots, rock weights, whatever might come loose, or Jaime somehow drift away in wave action or current. If there is going to be an attempt at body retrieval and subsequent investigation - and there will - it would help avoid suspicion and lingering mystery if Jaime’s remains was recovered and autopsied.
I liked Jaime, and don’t want to be under suspicion in his death for the next 10 years.
Think about how long the search has continued for some missing folks. I recall a massive years-long, reward-offered, social media blitz search for a solo paddler in Canada. IIRC his campsite and some gear was found, and there was an ongoing mystery about the condition of his things, but, as far as I know, despite not being in the remotest of places, never a trace of him.
Same with various hikers and backpackers. There was a multi-year’s long, still unsuccessful search for an experienced Sierra Club trip lead gone missing in the Chiricahuas. Or, same area, but actually inside Nat’l Monument trail area, NPS Ranger Paul Fugate; still searching 40 years later.
https://www.nationalparkstraveler.or...and%20vanished.
Or Everett Ruess. People are still looking for clues in Escalante after nearly 90 years.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Everet...ea%20of%20Utah.
I have doubts about burying Jaime at sufficient depth. If you have never buried a large dog try digging a human body sized hole at least a few feet deep in the backyard, but using only the implements you have at hand on a canoe trip.
Add roots or rocks in the soil and that’s a nope. There is a lot of stuff on my every-possibility Master-copy gear list, including a small bladed shovel (which still lives in the truck), but it no longer includes a kneeling-required-useless joke of an entrenching tool, and never a pick axe or BobCat backhoe loader.
Glenn has proposed a near worst case scenario, worthy of what-if consideration, but in any remote, days from civilization or outside contact situation I think the sensible actions and precautions remain much the same, all with the same cardinal rule – Make the body findable and, moreover, do not create another victim, or otherwise endanger the still living.
Add to an already daunting scenario Glenn’s caution
and my prime consideration would be that the survivors make it out alive and safely and, having succeeded at that, be able to identify a marked location to recover the body and begin the investigation.
How did Jaime die? Covid? Patient Zero for Canadian hemorrhagic fever? Brad’s other companion.
Mason’s Not-Dead-Yet fillet work?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DscJ5PFkZxQ
1. If this planning for a possible trip the 'What ifs...' need to be worked out with the group prior to leaving.
2. I won't bury, not enough soil most likely, no shovel to do it. Rocks may keep the larger animals away from the body but not the small ones. The body is going to start to decompose no matter what you do.
3. I would move the body as little as possible as brought up above the two survivors will start out as suspects, leave the site as undisturbed as possible, which means not moving the body back to the river.
2. I won't bury, not enough soil most likely, no shovel to do it. Rocks may keep the larger animals away from the body but not the small ones. The body is going to start to decompose no matter what you do.
3. I would move the body as little as possible as brought up above the two survivors will start out as suspects, leave the site as undisturbed as possible, which means not moving the body back to the river.
All of these references to hunting and what to do with the "carcass" are really stupid.
Not only that they are disrespectful. I would refuse to paddle on a long trip with anyone that thinks that way.
Not only that they are disrespectful. I would refuse to paddle on a long trip with anyone that thinks that way.
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