What to ask for in red cedar for stripping?

ThatPaddlingGuy · Sunday at 9:48 PM

I've dug around a bit and either this hasn't been clearly addressed here or I have just missed it in my searches, or it's just so doggone obvious nobody's been silly enough to ask yet. I HAVE seen people mention issues with flat sawn cedar and deformation/instability in the wood (I think specifically @memaquay mentioned this a couple times?). So my rookie stripper-building question is: What do I want to buy in order to cut my strips? My understanding is that quarter-sawn is the way to go: but does that mean I get quartersawn planks from the mill and then cut them to strips (with the @Jim Dodd skilsaw method), or does that mean I order a differently sawn plank to end up with quartersawn profiles in my strips?

I feel like I'm just massively overthinking this, but since my mantra is generally to follow the principles of K.I.S.S. I figured I'd just ask here and see what you all recommend. Also if I'm crazy for overthinking this, please feel free to just tell me so.

Cheers!

MyKneesHurt · Sunday at 10:19 PM

I have never built a stripper but I have worked with a massive amount of wood in my life, and have steamed a great many skin-on-frame ribs where grain orientation is important. As far as I understand, the strength of a stripper comes more from the glass than the wooden shell.
If you get quartersawn planks and then cut little vertical strips off of them and turn those strips 90degrees, you'll essentially be killing the structural properties that makes it a desirable wood - so the only advantage I can see is that your plank will react less to the stress of getting strips cut off of it,
If you want quartersawn canoe strips, the grain must run perpendicular to the wider surface of each cut strip, not perpendicular to the original plank - and the latter is what you'd be paying for buying quartersawn lumber. If you're sawing strips using a skilsaw/fence, then you need to make sure your starting edge is dang nice and straight, or every strip will follow that original uneven edge. (I've done jobs involving lots of little strips where I've cut a few, stopped, redressed the board, cut a few more, redressed, etc etc.)

Quartersawn is wood with annular grain running perpendicular to the cut dimensions. It's generally more expensive to buy from a mill, both because its less inclined to get all wonky and because cutting a log to maximize QS slabs takes more time and effort. If you're worried about it you can mill your own quartersawn out of flat- or rift-sawn boards; cutting a 1/4" strip off the edge of a flatsawn board will be fairly close to quartersawn. Again, that's dependent on the grain running fairly parallel to the dimensions of the board - if your grain runs out the side of the board halfway down its length, then that'll be a weak spot in a thin strip.

Jim Dodd · Sunday at 10:25 PM

I've delved into this a few times, over the years.

If you are cutting strips from 1X stock ? Purchase Flat grain, or Slash cut planks.
This will yield Quarter sawn strips.
These will be the strongest, non warping , easiest to sand, and machine, strips.

Some will tell you it doesn't make a difference. BS, in my book

Here is what the grain, of your planks, ideally should look l

https://hosting.photobucket.com/2d1cff85-238d-4a03-8a73-38d2e5e3ba5c/7cd56b22-cd36-45e1-b036-95886dfaeed4.jpg?width=320&height=320&fit=bounds

Jim

MyKneesHurt · Sunday at 10:34 PM

^Picture's worth a thousand words!

ThatPaddlingGuy · Sunday at 11:32 PM

MyKneesHurt said:
I have never built a stripper but I have worked with a massive amount of wood in my life, and have steamed a great many skin-on-frame ribs where grain orientation is important. As far as I understand, the strength of a stripper comes more from the glass than the wooden shell.
If you get quartersawn planks and then cut little vertical strips off of them and turn those strips 90degrees, you'll essentially be killing the structural properties that makes it a desirable wood - so the only advantage I can see is that your plank will react less to the stress of getting strips cut off of it,
If you want quartersawn canoe strips, the grain must run perpendicular to the wider surface of each cut strip, not perpendicular to the original plank - and the latter is what you'd be paying for buying quartersawn lumber. If you're sawing strips using a skilsaw/fence, then you need to make sure your starting edge is dang nice and straight, or every strip will follow that original uneven edge. (I've done jobs involving lots of little strips where I've cut a few, stopped, redressed the board, cut a few more, redressed, etc etc.)

Quartersawn is wood with annular grain running perpendicular to the cut dimensions. It's generally more expensive to buy from a mill, both because its less inclined to get all wonky and because cutting a log to maximize QS slabs takes more time and effort. If you're worried about it you can mill your own quartersawn out of flat- or rift-sawn boards; cutting a 1/4" strip off the edge of a flatsawn board will be fairly close to quartersawn. Again, that's dependent on the grain running fairly parallel to the dimensions of the board - if your grain runs out the side of the board halfway down its length, then that'll be a weak spot in a thin strip.

Makes sense, and since most of my fiberglassing experience is with laminating over foam I certainly understand that the main strength comes from the glass and the distance between the laminations: modern fibers are just amazing things! Thanks for chiming in with the clarification on the cuts! My biggest concern is the reports I have seen here and elsewhere on the internet about hulls being prone to deforming or going hog-backed in the process of building and in between laminations. Sounds like a nightmare I'd like to avoid! Also, as a guy with two knee surgeries behind me, my knees hurt too!

Jim Dodd said:
I've delved into this a few times, over the years.

If you are cutting strips from 1X stock ? Purchase Flat grain, or Slash cut planks.
This will yield Quarter sawn strips.
These will be the strongest, non warping , easiest to sand, and machine, strips.

Some will tell you it doesn't make a difference. BS, in my book

Here is what the grain, of your planks, ideally should look like.

Jim

Jim, thanks for clarifying for me! Also this makes me feel less like I'm an idiot for over-thinking. As I may have to prep strips without a jointer, hopefully I can find some flatsawn boards that are straight enough that I can get good results with the skilsaw strip-cutting method. I live in British Columbia, so I can definitely source some good cedar if I search around the mill guys.

Thanks again, Jim and MyKneesHurt!

ThatPaddlingGuy · Monday at 12:17 AM

Jim Dodd said:
I've delved into this a few times, over the years.

If you are cutting strips from 1X stock ? Purchase Flat grain, or Slash cut planks.
This will yield Quarter sawn strips.
These will be the strongest, non warping , easiest to sand, and machine, strips.

Some will tell you it doesn't make a difference. BS, in my book

Here is what the grain, of your planks, ideally should look like.

Jim

I forgot to mention, Jim, I can't see the picture: tried refreshing the browser. Maybe it's just on my end!
Cheers

Gamma1214 · Monday at 8:39 AM

Looks like they've got you pointed in the right direction already but don't hesitate to ask (even the silliest of) questions. Many of us got lots of help here in the past and welcome the opportunity to give back.

@Jim Dodd, the picture didn't come through for me either. Might need to click the "insert image" icon above (just to the left of the smiley) and the drop your jpg file into the pop-up box to upload the image. In that way, the image will remain visible until this site goes dark (unfortunately, they all do eventually)

scoutergriz · Monday at 9:11 AM

as important as the grain is the quality, you want Select Clear, or FAS (hardwood designation occasionally used by some mills for cedar), not knotty, #1, 2, 2 special, etc. Fence boards are usually #2 spec. or #3 for example
Select Clear means it's of uniform color and has no major defects like pitch pockets, wane, black, tight, or red knots, or other deformities, small pin knots(-1/8") are allowed as long as they occupy less than 30% of the useable board foot- this generally means that very little of the weaker and less rot-resistant sapwood makes the cut, and what sapwood is shown is usually confined to the extreme outer edge- any whitish material is usually sapwood and should only be used for utility pieces like laminated stems.

Jim Dodd · Monday at 9:55 AM

Hope it works this time. Been having trouble with Photobucket lately. They take my money, but reduced the service. Very hard to share pics !

Check my original post. Click the blue link.

Sorry and Thanks for the heads up guys !

Jim

Cruiser · Monday at 10:28 AM

Sourcing wood is the first hurdle in the build, gravitating to WRC is simply because it is the one most commonly referenced. Just realize that the wood itself is not structural, in the final product, in any meaningful way. It is simply a means to keep the fiberglass in the right orientation. That is why lighter woods with with good crush resistance are desirable. Cutting the way Jim suggested is best for sanding, leveling and ease of cutting.

What wood you pick is largely based on what you plan to do with the boat ... for me, I have to carry it, so I worry about weight. If you aren't worried about weight, then the options open up a lot. There is also local availability, which is going to help with the cost ... if you add a location to your profile, it gives us a better chance to help with suggesting wood sourcing and options.

You mention using a jointer for strip prep, this suggests to me you are overthinking this part of the build. The strips will eventual be shaped and sanded repeatedly, it is important to get them to be consistently sized and the finishing steps will take care of the rest. If you joint and run through a planer and get beautiful furniture grade strips ... realize that you will be gluing, shaping and rough sanding the whole lot later on ... so all that painful work will just get sanded away in the end.

This is a link to how quite a few of us prepare strips, it's worth while considering, as it will save a lot of effort IMO.

SkilSaw Method for Strip Cutting ... a primer

Jim Dodd suggested I write up something on making strips with the "Skilsaw Method" .... this will be that something, hopefully useful to some. I first saw this method in a post by Jim Dodd (he doesn't claim credit for it, just passes it along), on the BearMountain builders forum, I had just...

www.canoetripping.net

Brian

Cruiser · Monday at 10:29 AM

Jim Dodd said:
Hope it works this time. Been having trouble with Photobucket lately. They take my money, but reduced the service. Very hard to share pics !

Check my original post. Click the blue link.

Sorry and Thanks for the heads up guys !

Jim

Dropped them a long time ago, when they first started all the nonsense. Google Photos is free and works well

Gamma1214 · Monday at 8:47 PM

Not to beat a dead horse but none of us are immortal (at least, as far as we know). When the day comes that one stops paying for photobucket (or their personal website), all pics, stories, etc will be lost and the links here will just be dead links.

Maybe that's not a concern but there is a lot of great info, pics, etc that are going to be lost if not loaded directly to this site.

(Sorry for the drift TPG... pet peeve of mine)

ThatPaddlingGuy · 2025-10-28T00:57:06-0400

scoutergriz said:
as important as the grain is the quality, you want Select Clear, or FAS (hardwood designation occasionally used by some mills for cedar), not knotty, #1, 2, 2 special, etc. Fence boards are usually #2 spec. or #3 for example
Select Clear means it's of uniform color and has no major defects like pitch pockets, wane, black, tight, or red knots, or other deformities, small pin knots(-1/8") are allowed as long as they occupy less than 30% of the useable board foot- this generally means that very little of the weaker and less rot-resistant sapwood makes the cut, and what sapwood is shown is usually confined to the extreme outer edge- any whitish material is usually sapwood and should only be used for utility pieces like laminated stems.

Really appreciate this breakdown of the details to keep an eye for! Thanks @scoutergriz

Cruiser said:
Sourcing wood is the first hurdle in the build, gravitating to WRC is simply because it is the one most commonly referenced. Just realize that the wood itself is not structural, in the final product, in any meaningful way. It is simply a means to keep the fiberglass in the right orientation. That is why lighter woods with with good crush resistance are desirable. Cutting the way Jim suggested is best for sanding, leveling and ease of cutting.

What wood you pick is largely based on what you plan to do with the boat ... for me, I have to carry it, so I worry about weight. If you aren't worried about weight, then the options open up a lot. There is also local availability, which is going to help with the cost ... if you add a location to your profile, it gives us a better chance to help with suggesting wood sourcing and options.

You mention using a jointer for strip prep, this suggests to me you are overthinking this part of the build. The strips will eventual be shaped and sanded repeatedly, it is important to get them to be consistently sized and the finishing steps will take care of the rest. If you joint and run through a planer and get beautiful furniture grade strips ... realize that you will be gluing, shaping and rough sanding the whole lot later on ... so all that painful work will just get sanded away in the end.

This is a link to how quite a few of us prepare strips, it's worth while considering, as it will save a lot of effort IMO.

SkilSaw Method for Strip Cutting ... a primer

Jim Dodd suggested I write up something on making strips with the "Skilsaw Method" .... this will be that something, hopefully useful to some. I first saw this method in a post by Jim Dodd (he doesn't claim credit for it, just passes it along), on the BearMountain builders forum, I had just...

www.canoetripping.net

Brian

Brian, thanks for reminding me of the skilsaw thread: I am certainly planning to use that method, but I mis-remembered that you had to start with a trued-up edge (which lead to my jointer concerns). Reviewing the thread reminded me how some of those boards are NOT that straight, and the results are still great, so thanks for the reminder!

As far as wood selection WRC is a bit of a no-brainer for me: i'm on Vancouver Island, British Columbia, Canada, so WRC is all around, locally milled and available. Also I am pretty focussed on keeping weight down as I have had two knee surgeries and have a dicey ankle, so keeping things as easy on the joints as possible is a priority for sure. I'm leaning towards WRC for almost everything, for those reasons, and possibly using yellow cedar for epoxied-on uniwales as well. Just handles, no decks, and adjustable seats being maybe my allowed 'extra weight', to make for more flexibility as my son grows and we go from toodling around fishing to doing some trips.

Not sure when I will be able to make this build a reality, but I am getting my ducks in a row mentally. Thanks for all the input! I look forward to writing a build thread: hopefully sooner than later.

scratchypants · 2025-10-28T06:55:32-0400

What continues to surprise me is how little wood it takes, especially when you are looking at the uncut pile of lumber. It never looks like enough.

I took the measurements of the largest form, divided by strip width = ~65 strips. 4" wide lumber, thin kerf blade, roughly 12 strips per board. Length of lumber averaging 8 - 10', so double it = about 12 boards. In reality, though, it only took about 9 boards for my Freedom 17'.

scoutergriz · 2025-10-28T09:22:27-0400

ThatPaddlingGuy said:
Really appreciate this breakdown of the details to keep an eye for! Thanks @scoutergriz

Brian, thanks for reminding me of the skilsaw thread: I am certainly planning to use that method, but I mis-remembered that you had to start with a trued-up edge (which lead to my jointer concerns). Reviewing the thread reminded me how some of those boards are NOT that straight, and the results are still great, so thanks for the reminder!

As far as wood selection WRC is a bit of a no-brainer for me: i'm on Vancouver Island, British Columbia, Canada, so WRC is all around, locally milled and available. Also I am pretty focussed on keeping weight down as I have had two knee surgeries and have a dicey ankle, so keeping things as easy on the joints as possible is a priority for sure. I'm leaning towards WRC for almost everything, for those reasons, and possibly using yellow cedar for epoxied-on uniwales as well. Just handles, no decks, and adjustable seats being maybe my allowed 'extra weight', to make for more flexibility as my son grows and we go from toodling around fishing to doing some trips.

Not sure when I will be able to make this build a reality, but I am getting my ducks in a row mentally. Thanks for all the input! I look forward to writing a build thread: hopefully sooner than later.

being on the island you have one option for seat and trim materials that most of us don't that has a very good strength to weight ratio, meaning less material for equal strength- Douglas (or BC) Fir. while being heavy per board foot compared to other softwood, it's strength rating (janka hardness) is almost 2-1 over W pine or cedar, while the weight is generally only 15-20% more, and is actually less when compared to old growth cedar or pine, this means parts like stems, keels, caps and seat rails can be made thinner while maintaining the same strength, plus fir is fairly close in colour and grain pattern to WRC and is more durable

ThatPaddlingGuy · 2025-10-28T12:30:57-0400

scratchypants said:
What continues to surprise me is how little wood it takes, especially when you are looking at the uncut pile of lumber. It never looks like enough.

I took the measurements of the largest form, divided by strip width = ~65 strips. 4" wide lumber, thin kerf blade, roughly 12 strips per board. Length of lumber averaging 8 - 10', so double it = about 12 boards. In reality, though, it only took about 9 boards for my Freedom 17'.

I'm glad to hear you mention this, because I have run some board foot calculators and kept feeling like there was no way that so few planks would turn into enough strips for a whole canoe. But I double and triple checked and it kept coming up the same, and your experience supports that. Ultimately it makes sense but it somehow seems like such a small inconsequential handful of planks!
Cheers!
Really enjoyed reading through your Bob's Special (I think it was? In your upstairs shop?) thread, by the way, Scratchy!

ThatPaddlingGuy · 2025-10-28T12:33:37-0400

scoutergriz said:
being on the island you have one option for seat and trim materials that most of us don't that has a very good strength to weight ratio, meaning less material for equal strength- Douglas (or BC) Fir. while being heavy per board foot compared to other softwood, it's strength rating (janka hardness) is almost 2-1 over W pine or cedar, while the weight is generally only 15-20% more, and is actually less when compared to old growth cedar or pine, this means parts like stems, keels, caps and seat rails can be made thinner while maintaining the same strength, plus fir is fairly close in colour and grain pattern to WRC and is more durable

That's a great point: maybe doug fir would be an even better choice than yellow cedar for that. It's not cheap (nothing is) but it's certainly readily available. I didn't realize that it has such a dramatically higher strength! Thanks for sharing that: I love how fir looks too. The splinters always seem to get infected and nasty though: the only downside I have experienced in working with it!
Cheers!

ThatPaddlingGuy · 2025-10-28T12:58:33-0400

Gamma1214 said:
Maybe that's not a concern but there is a lot of great info, pics, etc that are going to be lost if not loaded directly to this site.

I share this concern Gamma! I've learned A LOT over the years, in many different areas of knowledge and practical skill-building, from sifting through forums. And with the increased intensity of AI I am finding fewer and fewer good reliable websites and good results from broad internet searches, so I feel that forums are more and more important. I won't drift the whole thread either, but I agree: maintaining threads intact for as long as possible is a worthy goal.
And I appreciate the opportunity to ask even the silliest questions, too!

scratchypants · 2025-10-28T18:32:23-0400

The Freedom 17 build is in there, too.

Cruiser · 2025-10-28T19:15:59-0400

I did do a lighter weight build thread, with newer folks in mind ... you may find something of interest here:

Light Weight Solo Tripper Build

This will be a somewhat ambitious build ( at least for me), the design will be a 15' solo cedar strip with a max weight of 30 pounds and still be tripping tough. I also want to take a hand in the design portion and I don't intend to resort to one of the standard CAD programs as they are just a...

www.canoetripping.net

and my current (although somewhat behind schedule:

Solo on the Light Side

Solo on the Light Side Over the past couple of months, I noticed something about the canoe lookingfor/purchase/release threads that I never noticed before. There is a repeating theme of wanting to tweak and change some things, wishing for others in various boats, as they get discussed. It...

www.canoetripping.net

Both are focusing on building lighter weight canoes.

Brian

What to ask for in red cedar for stripping?

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