What's happening in your shop this winter?

[Alan Gage]

Shop improvements? Rehabbing boats? Building boats? What's on your agenda?

So far for me it's been finishing up a couple projects in the house. The spare bedroom has been a repository for anything and everything since I built my house a few years ago. That's not necessarily going to change but I finally got around to building a basic bed and some shelving units so at least now it will be a somewhat organized repository. Now that that project is done I can get all the junk moved out of the shop (room got emptied out for the work) so I can start working on canoes.

First up will be finishing repairs on the Sawyer Cruiser Super-light I started last winter. Just a couple fiberglass patches that need one last coat of epoxy and sanding. Maybe replace the lexan bucket seats with carbon since I have a couple already made up without a home.

Then build another tandem canoe to be donated to the county Nature Center for them to raffle off. I'll use it as a mold to make a composite version for myself before it comes off the strongback.

Then a composite version of my Bloodvein.

And if time and ambition permit another boat that's to be determined.

I'm hoping by the end of the weekend to have the shop cleaned up and ready to go. Finishing a nifty cabinet to hold and dispense all my rolls of composite fabrics. That's going to be a lot better than having them littering the shop floor.

Alan

 

[Jim Dodd]

I always have boxes of scrap cloth around. Need to get a bigger box ! HA !

I tried to organize my sand paper stuff. It's still a mess !

Cleaned my work bench. It will always be a mess. I did find things that I had forgotten about. It won't be long before I forget where they are.

Have two insulated garage doors that I want to seal, after I get vehicles shuffled around for Winter.

OH ! Made some cool mouse traps ! Robin could have used one in his Deer camp !

You start with a 5 gal bucket, take a piece of 1"PVC, or electrical conduit, anything about that diameter will work, cut it about 2" wider than the bucket. screw two sheet rock screws sticking up on opposite sides of the bucket rim. This keeps the pipe from rolling off.
Put about an inch or two of water in the bucket. Take the pipe and coat the middle area with peanut butter.
lay the pipe so it will roll back and forth on the bucket rim.
Make it easy for the mouse to get to the top of the bucket. He will crawl out on the pipe, and roll off into the water, where he will drown.
Picked up this trick from a cuz, who caught 37 mice in one month.
I made three traps and caught two mice, the first nite.
I know a picture would be better. I'll try and post one tomorrow, if I have time !

Now back to Winter stuff. I have strips cut, just teeter toting back and forth on what to build.

Cheers !

Jim

 

[sweeper]

My shop is clean, I haven't been able to work down there in a while.
I have an 18' #1000 Burgess Canoe in Dry Dock down there waiting on refinishing, new seats and new canvas. I found a long Voyager paddle for cheap money that I'm cutting down and I'm trying to talk my canoe partner into the shop to build a couple paddles

 

[Muskrat]

No Title

This... see attached. Then cleaning it out. I have created an incredible mess in such a small space (1 car garage). And building a rack for my guideboat to free up some floor space for the next project, or for room for my roommate to park her car in the winter. I've seriously abused my garage privileges over the last two years.

 

[stripperguy]

I've been quite busy, nothing boat related...
Put hardwood flooring in our living room and den
Installed a brand new NG Navien condensing boiler for baseboard heating/on demand DHW with primary/secondary loops, 4 zones, 1 radiant, installed all new pex water lines---94% efficient.
Bought, stained, varnished, hung a pair of 6 panel doors in den
Added Durango steering gear to my Jeep LJ, added frame crossmember to stiffen track bar mount
Prepared 4 rental units for occupancy, various dates (Sept 1, Oct 1, Oct 1, Nov 1)

Boat related: bought carbon fiber cloth for all composite or cedar/carbon canoe build. Also, still modeling previously built Kite using Autodesk Inventor, for purposes of analysis and prediction.

 

[Canotrouge]

My plan is to build a bunch of paddles, an other wanigan or two, I would like to make a portage pack, and a few other little things.... I have 2 composites canoes to fixe for clients... but I need to find a real shop for that! Maybe a bathroom reno, maybe a kitchen reno....... The list is quite long, but really paddles, wanigan and a few other little woodworking projects are the priority!

 

[Mihun09]

So what is that, only 4 boats this Winter Alan?

 

[Robin]

I have 2 Chestnuts that need to be finished, a Pal and a Chum. I need to find some long ash for gunnels, trying to avoid splices.

I have 4 beavertail paddles I bought that I want to refinish and burn names/figures onto for my daughter/son in law and two boys (2-57" and 2-48") Then build a rack for displaying them, all for Christmas.

I need to install a new zipper in my wall tent, improve some of the sewing on it and make some improvements to my wood stove.

I have two old wooden/canvas folding chairs that I want to restore. I'm done with those metal frame ones. Armrests are over-rated...., and a wood canvas canoe needs a beautiful wood canvas camp chair, Ha, it never ends!

Finally, I need to get some venison, either a gift from my boys or if I can manage to sit it out in the cold myself, then plan alot of venison meals cooked over my shop wood stove in a cold handle, sitting in my restored wood/canvas seat, rubbing snow seal on the leather straps of my Duluth packs, dreaming of Northwest Ontario.

 

[Guest]

I tried to organize my sand paper stuff. It's still a mess !

Jim, I had to laugh at that, having done the same earlier this summer when I re-reorganized my sandpaper box for the umpteenth time.

I am frugal and hate to waste things, so I tend not to discard a piece of sandpaper until it has the abrasion qualities of a wet paper towel over 100% of the surface. Hey, there’s a wee corner on this piece I could still use on something small, back in the box it goes.

Past reorganizations consisted of sorting through the piles of used sandpaper and putting them in gallon ziplocks labeled 80, 120, 220, 400, 600, etc. Tres organized.

The problem is that when I come to a sanding job I would look at those bags of used, worn out sandpaper…..and grab a virgin sheet instead. And then carefully put that used sheet in its proper bag when I was done. I had enough used worn out sandpaper to last me for years. Especially since I never actually used it.

I sat down this summer during a major shop cleaning with the idea that I would sort out the still useful used sandpaper from the compete crap. After 20 minutes of sorting through bags of useless sandpaper ISO a piece I might actually use someday I threw the entire mess in the trash.

Of course I cannot break the habit of saving used sandpaper, so in 10 years I’ll have to steel myself to throw away another trashcan full.

A couple of random notes on sandpaper. I really like the “Pro-grade” or advanced 3x or 10x stuff. I’m not sure I believe that it lasts 3 times longer, but I do believe the extra cost is worth the extra efficiency, especially when hand sanding.

And beware the wet sandpaper at Home Depot sold in slender 1/3 sheet packs. That stuff has a plastic backing that make it more durable and it really does last 10 times longer.

Or infinity longer. The plastic backing makes it impossible to hold when wet. And I mean impossible; I could never manage to keep my hand on the paper when wet. Using it was a comical fail, wet the boat and paper, place sandpaper against hull, slide hand off sandpaper leaving paper unmoved it original location.

 

[pblanc]

Mike, you remind me of the old Irish widow who died and when cleaning out her closet the relatives found two big bags, one labelled "String" and the other "String Too Short to Save".

Having just finished resurrecting an old Mad River ME whitewater canoe and re-outfitting an even older Whitesell Piranha whitewater canoe as a tandem, I must now redirect my attention to all the various projects that I have been putting off. These include some wooden paddle and yoke refinishing, wooden gunwale sanding and re-oiling, gel coat chip repairs on a couple of boats, applying a coat or two of epoxy and then varnish to the hull of a Wenonah Advantage Kevlar ultralight boat, painting the bottom of the hull on my Hemlock Shaman, sanding and repainting the hulls of two wooden sea kayaks I built years ago, building a wooden canoe rack to go into a storage locker, and finally, the labor of hate and probable exercise in futility that I have been dreading the most: rebuilding the entire hull bottom of an Esquif Mistral Twin-tex tandem that was built with a balsa core bottom that rotted.

I have been halfheartedly working on that last project off and on for over a year and only sheer pigheadedness has made me determined to finish it.

I should probably get going on that list straightaway but just thinking about it has tired me out so I think I will just have a beer instead.

 

[Guest]

Mike, you remind me of the old Irish widow who died and when cleaning out her closet the relatives found two big bags, one labelled "String" and the other "String Too Short to Save".

Pete, you must have a hidden camera in my shop. I do keep a bag of “String too short to save”, although mine is labeled “Rope for DougD”.

Every few years when that bag is full I hide it in his car or amidst his gear. The last time he was here I put it in a Blue Mountain Outfitters bag and stuffed it under his passenger’s seat, so that when he unpacked the car he got all excited about finding some BMO package.

Doug in turn hides it somewhere in his friend Matt’s stuff. Although knowing him I bet he goes through it first to see if there is anything usable.

and finally, the labor of hate and probable exercise in futility that I have been dreading the most: rebuilding the entire hull bottom of an Esquif Mistral Twin-tex tandem that was built with a balsa core bottom that rotted.

I have been halfheartedly working on that last project off and on for over a year and only sheer pigheadedness has made me determined to finish it.

I’ll be interested in how and with what you reinforce the bottom of that balsa-core Mistral. Pigheaded Pete; I’m looking for a winter canoe rebuild project, but I wouldn’t touch a Mistral and especially not one with a rotted balsa core.

I should probably get going on that list straightaway but just thinking about it has tired me out so I think I will just have a beer instead.

Now there’s a shop project I can get behind.

 

[Canotrouge]

I have two old wooden/canvas folding chairs that I want to restore. I'm done with those metal frame ones. Armrests are over-rated...., and a wood canvas canoe needs a beautiful wood canvas camp chair, Ha, it never ends!

Finally, I need to get some venison, either a gift from my boys or if I can manage to sit it out in the cold myself, then plan alot of venison meals cooked over my shop wood stove in a cold handle, sitting in my restored wood/canvas seat, rubbing snow seal on the leather straps of my Duluth packs, dreaming of Northwest Ontario.

Robin, would you mind showing pictures of those fine sitting you are talking about??

Yeah, our freezer is getting quite empty, got a few grouse, Hare, but other than that it is getting thin... I need to find meat soon. It look like it will be a good year for the hare in our area, they are every where... but it takes a lot to fill up the freezer! So a Bison would be better!!

 

[BWCA66]

First I need to finish insulating and hook up the furnace I picked up this summer. Then there is a strup canoe that been sitting for 3 years that needs finishing and then I think a wanigan is in order

 

[pblanc]

I am a bit worried about possibly hi-jacking the thread but since it sort of pertains to the OP's query and since you asked, I will say a few words about the Mistral project. I have taken a few pictures as I went along and can take some more and might put up a thread when I am finished for the benefit of any poor souls who might have a boat of this type, and those with a taste for schadenfreude who might derive pleasure from reading about another person's misfortune and misery. If I do, however, it will come with the disclaimer that I would never recommend anyone undertaking a silly endeavor of this type.

The balsa core on the bottom of this hull occupied a space in the shape of an elongated diamond with truncated tips measuring 10' in length and 36" in maximum width at the center. The balsa was sandwiched between two sheets of Twin-tex which had been thermo-formed around the core. As pinholes developed in the outer Twin-tex layer of the hull bottom and started to progressively rot the wood core, which was pretty much inevitable in a boat of this type, the inner Twin-tex layer over the core started to delaminate from the rest of the hull bottom. My original hope was that I could remove the inner Twin-tex layer to expose the core, repair the core as necessary, then bond one or more fiberglass layers over it with epoxy. When I saw the condition of the core I realized this was out of the question, the core was beyond repair and would need to go, and the bridges were burned insofar as just using boat as it was until it rotted to the point of having no structural integrity left in the hull bottom. After removing all of the balsa core and cleaning up the fragments, I was left with a hull bottom consisting of one layer of Twin-tex which was more or less intact (other than pinholes) but ridiculously floppy.

The problem with bonding anything to Twin-tex, and what pretty much destroyed any prospects of it being a viable material for canoe construction, is the difficulty of getting any reasonably priced, workable adhesives to bond to it. It consists of fiberglass which is thermo-formed in a plastic matrix. I have read that the plastic is polyethylene and have also read that it is polypropylene. As you know, only some really expensive adhesives will reliably bond to polypro so I had no idea if I could achieve bonds of sufficient strength even using G Flex epoxy after flame oxidation.

So I started out bonding a series of E fiberglass tape strips transversely across the area previously covered by the wood core. This appeared to work but I found that it was surprisingly easy to overheat and permanently deform the Twin-tex with even the briefest flame oxidation and wound up with multiple areas in which I had to push melted Twin-tex up into the hull interior and allow it to thermoset there so as to avoid having bumps project from the hull bottom. Better to have bumps sticking up into the hull interior, but that left a number of divots on the hull bottom that had to be filled in using g Flex and S 'glass in order to get the bottom back to something approximating its former shape.

After bonding about 9 E 'glass strips to the hull bottom crossing transversely and one going down the center longitudinally, I waited a long time before proceeding further to see if they delaminated. I realize that only actual use will prove the durability of the bond but waiting and repeatedly flexing in the hull bottom was the best I could do. I then filled in all the quadrangles between the tape strips with a full layer of 4 oz/sq yd S-2 'glass and G Flex which seems again to have bonded. I knew that if this first fiberglass blanket remained stuck down, I could do the remainder of the repair using cheaper conventional epoxy like West 105/206.

The next step will to be to lay down a blanket of thin (1.4mm) Coremat which is a polyester material impregnated with microspheres to reduce resin consumption. This will be to add thickness and provide some much-needed stiffness. A foam core would have been lighter since the Coremat still has significant resin consumption, but it would have been more expensive. The Coremat will need to be covered with at least one more full cloth blanket. If after the Coremat the hull bottom seems to be approaching a reasonable degree of stiffness, I will probably just use a single layer of 5.8 ounce 2x2 twill weave carbon fiber (which I happen to have), since the high-modulus carbon should provide a decent additional amount of stiffness. If it seems that more than that is needed (which I suspect will be the case) I will first apply another layer of 4 oz S-2 glass before the carbon. Lastly I will cover the seam between the rebuilt core and the adjacent Twin-tex hull with 'glass tape bound down with G Flex.

One of the most miserable aspects of this repair has been a result of the Twin-tex material shedding fibers. These are not merely itchy like regular fiberglass fibers, they seem to become imbedded in your skin and are painful. You can get these in you merely by leaning up against part of the hull bottom that has been abraded.

 

[Guest]

(Much Twintex repair difficulty snipped)

One of the most miserable aspects of this repair has been a result of the Twin-tex material shedding fibers. These are not merely itchy like regular fiberglass fibers, they seem to become imbedded in your skin and are painful. You can get these in you merely by leaning up against part of the hull bottom that has been abraded.

Better you than me Pete. I understand the pigheaded challenge of that can-it-possibly-be-repaired experiment , but Twintex proved to be far from the Holy Grail material from day one, difficult to near impossible to DIY outfit or repair, not nearly as impervious to damage as expected, and needing significant stiffening material incorporated in the bottom of the build in larger hulls.

Fail. Not. Next.

If you can make a silk purse out of that sow’s ear I’ll have a shop cold beer waiting next time you are passing by.

 

[dave0]

Going back to McCreas post. Bags of stuff that continue to haunt my abode is a problem! I know that I will need whatever I save sometime but after about 5 years I have to throw in the towel and say it's time to toss it. What is exempt is little pieces of rope. McCrea has kindly hidden bags of them as he stated for me and as a tradition I pass them on to my paddling buddy Hal making sure I hide them in the most obscure places I can think of..10 or so pieces of poly 1-2" cuts in the bottom of his sleeping bag, several pieces placed in a tool box, more hidden in his toilet kit, where ever I know it will be piss him off! The last bag was placed under his seat in his car that would take a while to find. Even his wife has helped by placing a bunch of them in his underwear drawer! At 4 in the morning or so is a good time to find more of this stuff! Had a good laugh over that one!

As for winter projects I have the carbon fiber Adirondack to work on. As well, since I am unfamiliar with CF I am trying to build a container/wanigan out of CF for my cook kit. Have it all worked out except for actually doing it. I want to learn how to work with this stuff.

dougd

 

[Jim Dodd]

Day two of my Mouse trap. Hope the pic will be easier to decipher, than my typing!

I built 4 more of these today, plan on making a few friends with mouse problems.

Jim

 

[Mihun09]

Day two of my Mouse trap. Hope the pic will be easier to decipher, than my typing!

I built 4 more of these today, plan on making a few friends with mouse problems.

Jim

Perhaps without the dead mice would have been a bit less disturbing.

 

[yellowcanoe]

Whats your mouse solution made of? What role do the clamps and the PVC pipe play?

Nothing in our shop. We got a trailer and will be off to paddle FL TX and AZ for a bit of the winter. Right now the bike from heck is in there Pitched me off the trail again today with its self controlled and unpredictable gear changes.

 

[sweeper]

My shop comes with a cat, she's cleaned the house and the barn and is now working on the neighborhood. Good kitty.