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Very sad - Another fatal bear attack
- Thread starter Gerald
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Sad tale and not that frequent, but remember that some black bears are predatory and you do not know what order they come in.
I was discussing this story with our conservation officer here in Preeceville. He has extensive training in dealing with potentially violent human clients. His training advises that pepper spray is generally ineffective against a charging, “goal-oriented” person intending physical harm. He says he would not rely on bear spray against an already charging bear. As the news item here indicated, bear spray just made the bear angry.
I’m curious If anyone on this site knows of instances when bear spray has/has not succeeded in deterring an already charging bear.
I’m curious If anyone on this site knows of instances when bear spray has/has not succeeded in deterring an already charging bear.
From the article it sounds like the poor women didn't know it was coming and wouldn't have had time to use the spray. The husband sprayed the bear and said it only made it mad, yet he didn't get attacked so maybe it worked for him. It may also have worked for the women if she had a chance to use it.
Paddling Pitt, I ran into a neighbor last week who's son in law had to spray a grizzly just days before. It worked for him.
I had read a long time ago that the spray was more effective on brown bears than black bears but haven't seen any info about it recently.
Paddling Pitt, I ran into a neighbor last week who's son in law had to spray a grizzly just days before. It worked for him.
I had read a long time ago that the spray was more effective on brown bears than black bears but haven't seen any info about it recently.
This spring I had a Black Bear at my remote northern Minnesota cabin. I did not try pepper spray but twice fired a 12 gauge shotgun over its head. Each time it was back in 5 minutes. The third time I was yelling at it but it stopped and turned and looked at me from 15 meters. It would be dark in an hour so I took the shot and put it down. I see bears all the time but not at the cabin because I am fastidious about keeping a clean camp. So many issues with pepper spray and getting caught with the spray blowing back that I am leery off depending on it. A Blueberry picker from Red Lake, Ont. was killed this summer by a Black Bear. Rare I know but there are some rogue Black Bears out there. I never worried about them but have learned my lesson.
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Last weekend hikers on a trail here in town were followed by a black bear and the black bear wouldn’t spook even after trying everything so when the bear was close enough they sprayed it, the bear spooked for 30 second and then he was back on the tail, following them, but never made it close enough for a second spray!! Also this spring there was talks about bears that have been sprayed more than once that sometimes it doesn’t bother them as much the second time than the first time!! The CO up here encourage people to only spray after trying everything else( shout, whistle, making yourself big etc) and making sure that when you spray you are close enough and with the wind in the right direction to make sure the bear get most of it where it counts. Nose and eyes!!
Curtis called advising me that a bear attacked her, that he sprayed the bear with pepper spray, and the bear got more angry."
Esquirol said his son-in-law told him he got a gun and shot the bear twice before it went down.
The husband was able to go get a gun but it sounds like the bear spray did not drive off the bear. That's not good at a family cabin.
From another news story:
“He called me and told me that Stephanie had been attacked by a bear. The bear wouldn’t let go so he shot the bear until it let go,” Esquirol said.
“He then proceeded to give her CPR but she had no pulse.”
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Devastating story, bring tears to my eyes bringing back memories of our friend Valerie and her daughter Adele who died a bit over a year ago...
Really awful. Thankfully when I have seen black bears on the trail or while deer hunting they want nothing to do with me, but around home is another story. They are not fearful. We have a large dog that gets unbelievably aggressive with them which scares me for her but grateful she lets us know when one is around for the family’s sake. I had one in the driveway once coming home from a motorcycle ride. Revving the engine and spinning the back wheel - it just stared at me. Maybe 15 yards away. It false charged and then walked away down the dirt road. I went inside and changed my pants... they are unpredictable.
Bob
Bob
Why would a bear stalk, sneak upon, and kill a human but not for food? I really don't understand the creatures.
I have a theory that bears were less of a problem and more afraid of humans when North American was populated by the native Indian communities. Then, a bear venturing into a community immediately would be met by 10 to 40 screaming and whooping men hurling spears, arrows, rocks and other missiles of pain and death. The bears would thus learn over generations, through punitive conditioning and the extinction of the most aggressive-toward-humans bear genes, to avoid human habitats at all costs.
Today, to do something similar, humans have to fill out goverment forms, get licenses, talk to bureaucrats, take courses, be familiar with a bunch of rules and regulations, call authorized animal control officials, and fear criminal or civil penalties for harming fuzzy-wuzzy creatures of nature. . . . And die.
I have a theory that bears were less of a problem and more afraid of humans when North American was populated by the native Indian communities. Then, a bear venturing into a community immediately would be met by 10 to 40 screaming and whooping men hurling spears, arrows, rocks and other missiles of pain and death. The bears would thus learn over generations, through punitive conditioning and the extinction of the most aggressive-toward-humans bear genes, to avoid human habitats at all costs.
Today, to do something similar, humans have to fill out goverment forms, get licenses, talk to bureaucrats, take courses, be familiar with a bunch of rules and regulations, call authorized animal control officials, and fear criminal or civil penalties for harming fuzzy-wuzzy creatures of nature. . . . And die.
Bear management is difficult. When they become habituated to humans, they can become dangerous. I carry bear spray, but if that doesn't work, a warning shot often does.
At really close range you may be in trouble no matter what you do. The secret is to be every vigilant, and never be at closer range with a a bear. That means a lot of looking around, having a dog, and making noise when you travel.
It is logical that this poor lady was in her own yard with her guard down and not paying much attention. The bear saw an opportunity to take prey and seized her. When I am working in the bush, I always feel better with a dog or two around on sentry duty to give some warning.
I give the forum members credit for having bush experience and understanding how these things can happen. Way too many people think black bears are timid and easy to scare off. Once you have been stalked by one you do not forget it.
At really close range you may be in trouble no matter what you do. The secret is to be every vigilant, and never be at closer range with a a bear. That means a lot of looking around, having a dog, and making noise when you travel.
It is logical that this poor lady was in her own yard with her guard down and not paying much attention. The bear saw an opportunity to take prey and seized her. When I am working in the bush, I always feel better with a dog or two around on sentry duty to give some warning.
I give the forum members credit for having bush experience and understanding how these things can happen. Way too many people think black bears are timid and easy to scare off. Once you have been stalked by one you do not forget it.
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A local here in Red Lake was attacked and killed by a bear a few weeks ago berry picking. Very sad as he was recently retired and enjoying retirement. He was here since the 50's and an avid outdoorsman, so he was aware of bears and the risks of bears. It has affected many locals outlook on being out in the bush.
However, there has been a spring bear hunt here for a few years now so those claiming this is cause is nonsensensical in my opinion. Habitat change due to climate change is affecting the natural order of things and is likely more of a factor if you ask me. Again just my opinion, I'm not a scientist, just a truck driver, which is almost the same thing.
However, there has been a spring bear hunt here for a few years now so those claiming this is cause is nonsensensical in my opinion. Habitat change due to climate change is affecting the natural order of things and is likely more of a factor if you ask me. Again just my opinion, I'm not a scientist, just a truck driver, which is almost the same thing.
The climate has changed 1.5 degrees C. How does that affect bear behavior?
Equating being a scientist with being a truck driver shows that you don;'t know what you are talking about at all.
Equating being a scientist with being a truck driver shows that you don;'t know what you are talking about at all.
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Fires and floods cause loss of habitat and food sources. They are more competitive for what remains. Dont forget that the moose and deer populations can suffer too and that takes away a major food source. Overhunting feeds into that as well. Lots of competition they are not used to.Everything evolves.
Red is just saying that these days everyone is a scientist it seems.
I will still rely on spray for a first defence in too close encounters. The shotgun is often not readily available but if a face full of bear spray gives me 10-15 minutes to arm myself then its worth having some.
Red is just saying that these days everyone is a scientist it seems.
I will still rely on spray for a first defence in too close encounters. The shotgun is often not readily available but if a face full of bear spray gives me 10-15 minutes to arm myself then its worth having some.
Lol. Exactly. I guess subtle humour is lost on some.
In my career, I was a scientist at the University of British Columbia. All of my colleagues and most of my friends were also scientists. It is my observation that pretty much all of us lacked the necessary skills and background to be able to qualify as a professional truck driver.
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Red langford: Thank you for graciously laughing it off.
Ppine: The language that you used in post #14, in response to Red Langford's post #13, is not really in the spirit of community that I hope to foster as the incoming Administrator of this Board: "you don;'t know what you are talking about at all."
In Doug's site announcement post this morning, he spoke in part about our "sense of community" and "sharing and caring."
Bear attack posts seem to be inherently controversial. Climate change is also controversial. Please tread carefully and thoughtfully when commenting on topics we all know to be controversial.
We all enjoy spirited discussions, gentle ribbing, and strong opinions, when done in a clever and respectful way. This is in large part what makes this site so entertaining and special.
Society at large, at least in the US, is currently in conflict. We do not want or need such conflict on this site. We all share a passion and joy for canoes and canoe tripping. Let's celebrate what we share and leave the rest outside.
Ppine: The language that you used in post #14, in response to Red Langford's post #13, is not really in the spirit of community that I hope to foster as the incoming Administrator of this Board: "you don;'t know what you are talking about at all."
In Doug's site announcement post this morning, he spoke in part about our "sense of community" and "sharing and caring."
Bear attack posts seem to be inherently controversial. Climate change is also controversial. Please tread carefully and thoughtfully when commenting on topics we all know to be controversial.
We all enjoy spirited discussions, gentle ribbing, and strong opinions, when done in a clever and respectful way. This is in large part what makes this site so entertaining and special.
Society at large, at least in the US, is currently in conflict. We do not want or need such conflict on this site. We all share a passion and joy for canoes and canoe tripping. Let's celebrate what we share and leave the rest outside.
G
Guest
Guest
Or many other professions. I spent 35 years among medical research scientists, including Lasker and Nobel winners. Brilliant people in their field, sometimes not so much in other ways.
One of our investigators had a new office desk being delivered. He was a self-sufficient sort and attempted to remove his old desk on his own. He tried getting it through his office doorway for some time before he called to ask for help. I arrived to find him stymied.
“Ah, Dr. M, your door is 32” wide and your desk is 30” tall”
“Yeah, so?”
“Well, if we lay the desk on its side it will slide right through”
My favorite was a researcher scurrying to get his refrigerators and incubators all connected to the emergency power outlets before a scheduled power outage. He plugged a couple of things into a power strip that evening and called me the next morning to complain that he had lost half his samples.
He had finished by plugging the power strip back into itself.
So, yeah, I don’t think I’d want either of them driving a big rig.
Yes, this is an absolutely awful story.
I wanted to add to the bear spray effectiveness question. I have carried bear spray for 20+ years both for work and personal use but have never had to use it (I have needed to use a gun unfortunately as well as bangers/paintball guns/shotguns with rubber slugs/group chasing and yelling, etc). Several years ago I was hiking with my daughter in thick bush. She was luckily on my back in her kids backpack as she'd gotten tired and was chattering away and told me there was a bear. I didn't think much until she reiterated and I turned around and there was a small to medium sized black bear coming up the trail behind us, not running but intent on us and coming quickly (lets call it a fast jog for a bear). Spun around and pulled out my spray and belt knife as backup and started advancing towards it (loud voice, etc). It stopped about 3 feet from me, snapping it's teeth, trying to circle us and acting very strange. I have been around hundreds of black bears and have never had one act like this (been chased by mad momma bears, etc). I read the Herrerra books years ago and have always been interested (from a self preservation perspective) in bear behavior. It was not a place where I would assume it was a garbage or overly people habituated critter. It did not appear to be angry, had it's ears up for the most part, but was snapping it's teeth and absolutely intent on getting at us from the back. I ran at it a few times and we danced around for quite some time, I would yell and run at it and it would back off slightly, but when I wanted to leave it would come right back at me. It was comfortable being about 4-5 feet from me face to face but when I retreated or tried to walk away it would very deliberately try to get at us from behind. I got tired of this and gave it a shot of spray directly in the face from about 3 feet. It did not make a sound, but bolted away from us so rapidly I was amazed. It ran through willows and thick undergrowth like a freight train, running into everything in it's path. I've used it once, under absolutely perfect conditions/application distance and it worked for me. Do I trust it? Not completely, but will continue to carry it. Was the bear in my encounter predatory? I am not sure, but I am certain things would not have ended well for us.
I wanted to add to the bear spray effectiveness question. I have carried bear spray for 20+ years both for work and personal use but have never had to use it (I have needed to use a gun unfortunately as well as bangers/paintball guns/shotguns with rubber slugs/group chasing and yelling, etc). Several years ago I was hiking with my daughter in thick bush. She was luckily on my back in her kids backpack as she'd gotten tired and was chattering away and told me there was a bear. I didn't think much until she reiterated and I turned around and there was a small to medium sized black bear coming up the trail behind us, not running but intent on us and coming quickly (lets call it a fast jog for a bear). Spun around and pulled out my spray and belt knife as backup and started advancing towards it (loud voice, etc). It stopped about 3 feet from me, snapping it's teeth, trying to circle us and acting very strange. I have been around hundreds of black bears and have never had one act like this (been chased by mad momma bears, etc). I read the Herrerra books years ago and have always been interested (from a self preservation perspective) in bear behavior. It was not a place where I would assume it was a garbage or overly people habituated critter. It did not appear to be angry, had it's ears up for the most part, but was snapping it's teeth and absolutely intent on getting at us from the back. I ran at it a few times and we danced around for quite some time, I would yell and run at it and it would back off slightly, but when I wanted to leave it would come right back at me. It was comfortable being about 4-5 feet from me face to face but when I retreated or tried to walk away it would very deliberately try to get at us from behind. I got tired of this and gave it a shot of spray directly in the face from about 3 feet. It did not make a sound, but bolted away from us so rapidly I was amazed. It ran through willows and thick undergrowth like a freight train, running into everything in it's path. I've used it once, under absolutely perfect conditions/application distance and it worked for me. Do I trust it? Not completely, but will continue to carry it. Was the bear in my encounter predatory? I am not sure, but I am certain things would not have ended well for us.
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