Live aboard motor canoe project

[Odyssey]

But will Noah, er, I mean Joel, give us a trials trip report? That would be cool.
Good luck Master Beckwith. It's a fun idea.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

Must be sort of bitter sweet: A good friend leaves on trip with a great new canoe, but the most challenging and intriguing project for the foreseeable future is gone.

You probably said this somewhere above, but where is the plank flooring stored during transportation?

 

[gumpus]

Just FYI. I hope the link works.

https://chicago.craigslist.org/wcl/boa/d/rare-69-grumman-sail-boat/6447295173.html

 

[Guest]

Odyssey, I anticipate receiving a report and photos of that rig in action, and will post them here.

Glenn, I was sorry to see that outfitting project come to an end, and am already looking forward to whatever improvements are found wanting when it reappears in the shop this spring. The platform planks are transported in one of the side storage boxes on the trailer, which itself was a lengthy rebuild and outfitting project several years ago.

I need to find a shop project or two, lest I get bored and start watching daytime television. I will steel myself against disappointment and check my Craigslist bookmarks within a couple hundred mile radius for some holed or gunwale rotted beater to refurbish, despite not having found such a project there in the last few years.

Gumpus, the 69 Grumman Sport is not really my kinda boat, and that is 2.5 times as much as I have ever paid for any canoe. Looking at the photos I am impressed that the owner managed to keep every part and piece intact and in good condition for nearly 50 years. Even the Grumman stickers on the leeboards are near pristine.

That last photo of that Grumman, fully outfitted and under sail, does make it look like fun.

 

[Odyssey]

Thanks Mike.

 

[yellowcanoe]

Because so many of the interior backcountry sites in the Everglades are closed post Irma the live aboard may well come in handy.. Chickees and interior ground sites still closed per the park map.
I wonder if Joel will hang a Room For Rent on it.. I might need it next month.

At any rate it will be hard to miss that craft!

That is if he is able to get down south with the recent family event.

 

[Guest]

I will steel myself against disappointment and check my Craigslist bookmarks within a couple hundred mile radius for some holed or gunwale rotted beater to refurbish, despite not having found such a project in the last few years.

Well that was as every bit as dreadful as anticipated. I checked my bookmarked Craigslists from New Jersey to North Carolina for the first time in a month. Dang, people have no idea about what a used canoe might fetch, and doubledang, there are a lot of crapty Colemans and Pelicans out there.

This one briefly got my interest, even though it is 37 inches wide and not especially light.

https://southjersey.craigslist.org/boa/d/holy-cow-166-kevlar-canoe/6436120729.html

I could draw it in a little when I replace the gunwales with strategically located thwarts, and single seat soloize it, but the dang keel kills any interest I might have.

Because so many of the interior backcountry sites in the Everglades are closed post Irma the live aboard may well come in handy.. Chickees and interior ground sites still closed per the park map.

At any rate it will be hard to miss that craft!

I am confident that rig, in one guise or another, platform live aboard with side floats, or simply used as a motorized freighter and driven onto some sandy no-permit beach in the Ten Thousand Islands, will come in handy.

If you see Joel there, let us know.

Next spring, before it heads to Lake Powell, the Miramichi gets fairleads and cleats and the big Pacific Action sail. Unless I happen to be along. I would prefer working the tandem Spirit Sail from the lazy bowman seat.

In either case we may need to cogitate some easy clamp on lee board arrangement.

 

[Guest]

The Live Aboard is far south in Florida now. And yet I am somehow still screwing with it.

Joel and I had discussed the need for a leeboard if running the Miramichi tandem with a large downwind sail. Screw tacking upwind, just fire up the motor.

Next spring, before it heads to Lake Powell, the Miramichi gets fairleads and cleats and the big Pacific Action sail. Unless I happen to be along. I would prefer working the tandem Spirit Sail from the lazy bowman seat.

In either case we may need to cogitate some easy clamp on lee board arrangement.

It is a big canoe, 20 feet long and 40 inches wide, and it will need a big leeboard.

We still have one aka tube and a pair of gunwale clamps available. Or I do, still here in my shop. I clamped that aka tube to the Wilderness just for a look see. The Miramichi of course is much deeper and wider.

P1220432 by Mike McCrea, on Flickr

Inserted in that crossbar tube, a thumb button adjustable sleeve, with a deeply threaded receiver post for a long beefy screw knob.

P1220433 by Mike McCrea, on Flickr

Screwed into that receiver, a vertical post with a big honking leeboard, 20 inches deep, and 13 inches across at widest. The screw knob allows that massive leeboard to pivot upright if dragged across the shallows, and it weighs close to 3 lbs, so gravity and screw knob tension will keep it down when sailing.

P1220436 by Mike McCrea, on Flickr

The leeboard can be removed from the crossbar tube entirely, without unscrewing the deeply threaded knob, by depressing a thumb button and sliding the receiver post out. We may add something simple so that it can be held horizontally out of the water when attached but not needed.

Like the motor rig and live aboard aspects, this will require some testing and further refinement. We could easily cut or reshape that leeboard as needed.

I really want to see how that big, seaworthy freighter sails with a decent tailwind.

 

[gumpus]

Another potential candidate for transformation by Mike's Motor Canoes

https://northernwi.craigslist.org/boa/d/classsic-canvas-canoe/6455134863.html

 

[Guest]

Another potential candidate for transformation by Mike's Motor Canoes

https://northernwi.craigslist.org/boa/d/classsic-canvas-canoe/6455134863.html

That is a cool, and I presume rare, canoe. The motorized RX Miramichi essentially an engorged Prospector, longer, wider and deeper, at the same custom outfitted weight.

I do not know how a wood and canvas hull would fare in the limestone and oyster bar shallows of the Everglades. heck, I expect to see some gouged and tattered Royalex come a shop visit trip this spring.

A 20 foot square stern Grumman might be clad in the best hull material, but those are as common and as pricey as Chestnut Prospector vee sterns.

In any case that Prospector design is likely more seaworthy than a Grumman 20.

 

[yellowcanoe]

Cool canoe and not rare. There are several around here and one was downtown by the road with a for sale sign on it all summer. Beefily built and with thick canvas wooden boats are excellent at enduring unfriendly encounters. They are still used for canoeing the Allagash with its rapids. Of course equally important is the skill of the paddler at field repairs in case of broken ribs or gunwales.

The brass tacks that hold these canoes together do not like salt. Corrosion is never your friend. I saw one Old Town that when de canvassed, just fell apart.. The canvas was its exoskeleton as the tacks had just corroded away.

 

[Guest]

Cool canoe and not rare. There are several around here and one was downtown by the road with a for sale sign on it all summer.
Of course equally important is the skill of the paddler at field repairs in case of broken ribs or gunwales.

The brass tacks that hold these canoes together do not like salt. Corrosion is never your friend. I saw one Old Town that when de canvassed, just fell apart.. The canvas was its exoskeleton as the tacks had just corroded away.

Brass tack corrosion, saltwater use, and sundry field repairs aside, any kind of motorizable square or Y sterns are rare as hens teeth in the mid-Atlantic region. Not much call for them here, more of a johnboat and motor around the tidal fringes of the Chesapeake Bay area.

Square sterns and Y sterns may be a more northern thing, from Canada and the US northeast, westward into Michigan, Wisconsin and eastern Minnesota. Although the last 20 foot Grumman square stern I saw for sale was in Texas.

I do not see a wood and canvas canoe being a good solution for Joel, in the Everglades or elsewhere. The constant joke in the shop is that Joel wears out most gear in a single season. WTF?

Oh, yeah, it could be that his single season is 300 days a year, half of that gearing up clients.

I can not understand why more paddlesport gear manufacturers do not ask guides, beyond a simple discounted pro-deal, to put their gear into actual abusive condition field testing, and report back suggested improvements regarding real world experienced failure points or inconveniences, based on their experience.

 

[gumpus]

I think you're both right. Rare depends on where you are. I think there was a thread on this site where Canadians were complaining that used Kevlar boats are rare and US folks are complaining that wood/canvas boats are so rare. From the ads I've seen the big motor canoes are in the northeast...not Michigan or west of here. I will stick up for the wood/canvas boat's potential durability (note the KEEL) and it's repairability...it is really well suited to field repairs if needed.

I was looking at the smallest Honda 4 stroke outboard on their site (2.3 hp). It burns less than 1/3 of one gallon per hour at full throttle. Two 6 gallon tanks (72 pounds of fuel) could take you hundreds of miles!

 

[Steve in Idaho]

Wow, what a project!

So - y'all might think this is weird.....but I expect that using the luggable loo while afloat may be an interesting challenge. I'm trying hard not to think about it.....

But with all that gear stowed below as ballast, I bet the tent platform works out just fine. I would have considered bringing a few extra cheap drybags though to fill with water as a replacement for the weight of food and fuel consumed.....lest privy time should become a little precarious.

 

[Guest]

So - y'all might think this is weird.....but I expect that using the luggable loo while afloat may be an interesting challenge. I'm trying hard not to think about it.....

But with all that gear stowed below as ballast, I bet the tent platform works out just fine. I would have considered bringing a few extra cheap drybags though to fill with water as a replacement for the weight of food and fuel consumed.....lest privy time should become a little precarious.

Good point. The bucket base for that luggable loo did not need to be high centered 14 inches tall, and could have been more of a squatty potty. I hope Joel has not found himself doing Omelianchik balance beam handstand twists to keep his evacuation balance.

I doubt we are done with refinements to that Live Aboard rig, and am looking forward to a spring shop revisit to make improvements.

Twere me, tis not, I would have a Yuedge sun reflective poly tarp easily erectable over the whole anchored rig for shade, with some rain collection vee pour off points into some onboard cistern, if only for dishwashing and personal hygiene uses.

https://www.amazon.com/YUEDGE-Portable-Lightweight-Water-resistant-Shelter/dp/B01ISTXD1W

A freshwater body wash feels so freaking good after a week on salt.

 

[yellowcanoe]

Looks like you have to saw off the stern.
Met Joel today. What else is new. We always meet Joel in some parking lot in the Everglades
our repair the trailer plans were sidelined by a fun hour yak fest in the Collier Seminole boat lot
discussion of propellor rotation and vortex spin direction
andChokoloskee Chop

He and his craft are camped near us. A pleasure to meet Miss Miramichi
so far she hasn

 

[Guest]

Looks like you have to saw off the stern.

Met Joel today. What else is new. We always meet Joel in some parking lot in the Everglades
our repair the trailer plans were sidelined by a fun hour yak fest in the Collier Seminole boat lot
discussion of propellor rotation and vortex spin direction
and Chokoloskee Chop

Joel should be skilled at trailer repair. It is probably hard not to encounter him somewhere along the way in Everglades winter travels.

Gawd I hope he does not try sawing off the stern and making a square ender out of that RX canoe, that sounds like a disaster in the makings. He muttered something about building a Y stern, I pretended not to hear that.

I have heard from Joel a few times between guiding trips, and he has made some discoveries about the motorized Miramichi.

First MPG test. 16 miles on 1.5L of gasoline.

First motor test run with a mostly empty hull. The Miramichi oil cans in waves at half throttle. That was a huge surprise to me, the Miramichi seems very stiff and stoutly built, and never oil canned a bit under paddle. I suspect the difference lies in paddling vs motor speeds in waves, and may be different when carrying a full gear load.

Propeller rotation and vortex spin. With a single person aboard the Miramichi leans to the left due to the engine weight hung off the side. I do not know if Joel has had a chance to try trimming the hull gear heavy on the right, that was kind of the plan. See folding platform weight and etc.

That lean is made worse with the motor running with the prop spin leaning the hull over even further. A bowmans weight would be handy to offset that.

I know Joel has taken it out as a simple motor canoe freighter, substituting a large tent, massive cooler, chair, table and etc comfort gear for live aboard platform and equipment, landed it on a sandy beach and looked happily ensconced. And plans a trial trip in Live Aboard guise.

The motorized Miramichi is headed to Maine in a few weeks, for some lake use as a tandem under motor and fishing canoe. Maybe we should put the third seat back in?

The answer looks to be a Y or square stern canoe, ideally a 20 foot Grumman for the latter. We are not done, when a friend says this, I am all in.

The dream of this boat is the freedom to camp where ever I chose and to finally be able to explore creeks that I have not been able to see because they are just to far from campsites and roads.

I have dreamed of this for many years. This is the second attempt. It may or may not work but the whole project has been a gift working with Mike and Steve at a time I needed a distraction the most.

 

[yellowcanoe]

Yep it was the lean to the left then more lean to the left with the motor running.
He said it was rather ....interesting as in frightful
a square stern Grumman would be a Joel cooker.
Bimini

and with waves coming from the left
nice Dynel job and kudos to Joel for getting it ON the trailer. All svelte 107 lbs

 

[yellowcanoe]

Any plans to build a stripper square stern live aboard?
mike you.need to be bow paddler
if It oil cans won

 

[yellowcanoe]

t a third seat occupant be ejected?