Info on Chivelston, Harris & Harold Lakes outside Wabakimi?

[Gamma1214]

I'm starting to plan for 2025 and thinking of a mid August / early September trip in the Wabakimi area. (hopefully this past July's bugs are dead by then)

At this point, I'm considering parking in Armstrong and taking the train to Chivelston Lake (just East of the Savant Lake stop). From there, go North through Harris and Harold lakes to Savant lake and follow the Savant River to the Palisade River which can get me to Whitewater Lake. I'll check out whatever is left of the Wendell Beckwith cabins then head to Whiteclay lake, go up the Raymond River, check the pictographs on Cliff Lake and exit via Moonshine, Big Lake and Little Caribou.

My understanding is that this loop should reduce cost by starting & finishing on crown land instead of the being inside the Provincial park the whole time, it will pass through some rarely visited areas with incredible scenery, pictographs in at least 2 locations and some good fishing. The trade-off for this is that some of the lakes are huge and the portages might be rough or non-existent.

One thing I really like is that, if the portages turn out to be total bush-whacking, I'll have lots of options to shorten the route when I get to Whitewater (I have 2 weeks vacation from work but I'm figuring on taking an additional week without pay so I'll have 3 weeks at my disposal)

I've contacted Friends of Wabakimi (@jdeerfoot has been especially helpful), Ramblin' Boy, the Saugeen First Nation and Mattice Lake Outfitters for information on the state of the portages between the rail line and Savant (almost certain to be the least traveled section of the proposed route) but, so far, I've not been able to get any information and Google searches have yielded nothing.

(I've been hesitant to contact Bruce Hyer. Although I suspect he may have the best maps and information, he's also pricey and I don't want to waste his time unless I'm willing to cough up the $500 that seems to be his starting point)

Both Paddleplanner & the FOW planning map show portages existing but that's certainly no guarantee... Does anybody here have insight or an idea of where else to look for info?

Unless someone talks me out of it, I'll probably have the train dump me off & see what I find but I'd like to know that there's a reasonable chance of getting through. (and, yes, I'll post the inReach link here so you can follow along / speculate on difficulty / be glad you're not me... hell, maybe we can have a fundraiser with a "how far does he get / does he bail out via Smoothrock or press the SOS button" pool...)

 

[memaquay]

Not sure if I posted this info before, but Ramblin Boy's trip reports are probably the best on the internet. We were both interested in the section of the Pikitigushi river after Cliff lake, and he actually did it. I believe you will find the info in this trip report. https://albinger.me/2018/11/06/down...-nipigon-logistics-maps-and-day-1-cliff-lake/

 

[Gamma1214]

Thanks mem. If you'd mentioned it, I'd forgotten.

What's your opinion... can a mere mortal go from railroad to railroad in 3 weeks?

 

[memaquay]

Hard to say. There is some pretty tough country up there, and to think optimistically about portages is setting yourself up for trouble. I have great respect for David Jackson, but keep in mind his level of dedicated masochism is top tier, so if he claims that most portages will be obvious once located, he might actually mean he only had to climb over and around 55 windfalls on a 100 meter port. That's the other thing....locating the portages. If you have a good GPS and accurate data, locating the ports might not take an entire day. In the absence of data, locating some of these ports might never happen. Our method is to go where we think the portage might be, and then start walking cross lines for about two hundred yards, each way, moving deeper in to the bush with each sweep, looking for previous cut evidence, blazes, and trails. You will often find a good trail and have an "aha" moment, and follow it until it disappears, and then realize you are simply following a game trail that started from nowhere and ended up in nothing. The process is quite rigorous and exhausting, as you will usually be jumping over windfall like a geriatric kangaroo, imitating a Cirque du Soleil performer as you twist and writhe and try to prevent impalement on broken branches as you stumble and fall over that last downed tree.

However, perhaps Wabakimi is different. I've never gone there, don't paddle in places you have to pay daily rates. If I was paying that daily rate, I would certainly expect the portages to be maintained, so perhaps it will all work out. Just keep in mind you need to develop several exit routes in case things don't line up.

 

[Aslowhand]

I hope it's okay if I chime in again ...
According to my information, over the last three years, portage clearing crews have been operating on the route you planned from Rockcliff Lake to Pikitigushi Lake. I personally travelled through Kenoji Lake on the Palisade River to Burntrock Lake in 2023 (but then took a different route than you) and last year I visited Whitewater Lake, Whiteclay Lake, Raymond River and Pikitigushi River down to the logging road before a clearing crew went along there. I made it through, so anyone else can too. These sections of your route are used relatively often (in Wabakimi standarts), which suggests that the portages are at least passable.
My experiences in the Savant Lake/River region are far too old, so I can't provide any current information (watch out for caribou at the northernmost part of Lake Savant).
Memaquay mentions the daily rates; as non-Canadians, we have to pay to sleep in the dirt in Ontario anyway; on Crownland, the fee is about $10, and in the park, it's $15. Therefore, my reasoning is that I'd rather pay $15 with the prospect that the portages might be maintained.
If I were to follow your planned route, I would allow at least four weeks. But I'm a rather slow traveler and prefer to have time for fishing, photography, and simply enjoying the surroundings.

 

[Gamma1214]

Thanks, guys. I didn't mean to put mem (or anyone) on the spot this morning and I know that the only way to find out is to take the plunge.

Realistically, I've mapped 2 exits and 2 ways to shorten the route if needed. In addition, I could call Don Elliot or Clem Quenville and get picked up McKinkley Road or Airport Road as well. I've got lots of options and, if I don't mess around too much or catch really nasty weather...

PS: Aslowhand, of course it's OK to chime in. I will, almost certainly, not have 4 weeks... it'll be interesting to see how this plays out.

 

[jdeerfoot]

Regarding portage maintenance within Wabakimi PP - I wouldn’t expect much. If the park does port maintenance like they traditionally did it, they might have 2-2 person crews out during the season. And they probably concentrate on the popular routes the outfitters send their clients out on. For instance, in 2017 a buddy and I did a 3 week trip from Allanwater Bridge to Lake Nipigon to recon the route for the Wabakimi Project. We found most of the route passable with only a few areas needing clearing. On the Kopka Rv itself, we hiked north from the river toward Aldridge Lk, which is known as the Aldridge Lk route from the railroad to the Kopka. We found the first portion from the river north to a small lake to be freshly cut. Later that day we ran into four young Canadians who left the railroad and made the 1-1/2 day trip to the Kopka. The remainder of our trip revealed the entire route to be recently cut all the way to Bukamiga Lk just off Hwy 527, the usual end point of outfitter trips. The Canadians told the us the park supr, Shannon Lahr, told them they keep the route open each season because the outfitters sell a lot of trips there.

The park is so vast and the staffing so minimal that it is probably best to assume no maintenance takes place in most of it. As far as the surrounding Crown Lands, whatever is open there maybe due to outfitters keeping a few ports open between lakes for their fly in fishing clients.

 

[jdeerfoot]

Further regarding port maintenance, you may want call the park office in Thunder Bay ON and talk to the park superintendent, Shannon Lawr.

I just checked the park website and it appears the superintendent position is vacant. But there are other staff that can advise you on this.

 

[Gamma1214]

Well, this trip just got a whole lot tougher. Due to employment uncertainty and the work ethic that appears to disadvantage most of my generation, I delayed getting the train tickets locked in.

When I called VIA rail this morning to buy a ticket for August 10th, I found out that all Westbound canoe slots are taken from mid-July through early Sept.

I did reserve the only remaining slot on the Eastbound train from Armstrong with arrangements made to drop me at the Mud River whistle stop.

That means that I will need to go upstream the entire way... Raymond River, Ogoki, Palisade and Savant, all the while hoping that I can get through to Chivelston Lake and reach the tracks. I will also have to hope that they have space on the train for the canoe although that does seem more likely on Eastbound trains.

Alternatively, I could switch years, put this off until 2027, head back to Marshall Lake this August and do the much longer loop down the Kap River, through Tenant & Melchett Lakes and return to the car via Abamasagi Lake and @memaquay's infamous "Hellport". This would require no special planning at all and I was planning on doing that trip in 2027.

The whole thing may hinge on the availability of tickets from Chivelston Lake to Armstrong around the first of September. They can haul 6 canoes on the train and I'll put this out for your input:

If 1/2 or more of the slots are currently available (understanding that there is no guarantee they'll remain available), would you roll the dice and try the route East to West or delay it one more year knowing that Marshall Lake is certainly no slouch of a consolation prize?

I have until Monday to pay for the ticket or the reservation automatically cancels Monday at 9pm.

(BTW: really awesome that VIA rail caters to the indecisive traveler in that way. I wanna buy a ticket just so I can give them 5 stars)