Advice needed: packs for 2-3 nights in black bear country

[Magnus919]

I'm not really looking for packing out for 5+ nights at this point in time. But I'm in a position shortly to go on 2-3 night trips. For the kitchen pack, we do have black bears & coyotes here, and red wolves are coming back as well... so I'm guessing a food barrel is the way to go there, suspended from a tree limb at night? Is that still the prevailing thinking?

What would you take as a primary pack for such trips? I was admiring some of the Granite Gear kit but really have no idea what size is the right way to go.

 

[Magnus919]

I should probably clarify on my sleeping situation ... three season camping in the eastern 1/2 of North Carolina, sleeping in a Hennessy Hammock with whatever level of blanket or sleeping bag the weather forecast is calling for.

 

[yellowcanoe]

When I do a barrel I don't hang.. Some of our tripping is in areas with bears and without sturdy trees. Arctic willows suck and are short and don't support a thing. And black spruce is spindly. White pine lacks branches for many feet up. The one I am looking at has no branches for sixty feet above the ground.

You can stash away from camp.. The barrels are a deterrent against the most predominant of camp pests . Chipmunks and mice. For the most part bear are not interested in my dehydrated food though near here a bicyclist was met at a stop light by a granola seeking black bear.

Mostly bears are attracted to donuts and sweets.. Yes.. that is the composition of bear bait.. Dunkin Donut stale sweets. Fresh meat isn't used here though some areas do use it. If you have maple syrup make sure its in an odorproof container. Dog food is also a bear attractant
http://www.bowhunting.net/2011/03/15-surefire-black-bear-baiting-tips/

I don't worry much about bears but try not to pitch camp in berry bushes.. don't put your food there either. I am surprised you don't have bears as you do have berry bushes ( the other thread)

You can buy bear canisters if you wish. Bear Vaults work in the BWCA but in the Adirondacks in the Eastern High Peaks are still discouraged. Garcia and Counter Assault make other containers. Two of them can fit a small pack.. The GG Superior is one big pack but we had something similar for two in Wabakimi and the 121 liters does get filled.

 

[Iskweo]

A barrel is your answer and I dont do anything special, although karin likes to tie them to a tree at night. I prefer to put a pot on top as an early warning device. Keep a clean camp and dont burn food waste in the firepit. Garbage bag it. I have never had an animal in camp. I also keep my barrel in camp, close by, so I can make sure it stays with me. Take some firecrackers in case you need to be a bad nieghbour.

Good luck and have fun.

 

[Magnus919]

I am surprised you don't have bears as you do have berry bushes ( the other thread)

I actually live in Raleigh city limits. We rarely get any kind of bears this far in, and when they show up it makes the evening news. But they are all over the place down east and throughout the Dismal Swamp.

 

[yellowcanoe]

I actually live in Raleigh city limits. We rarely get any kind of bears this far in, and when they show up it makes the evening news. But they are all over the place down east and throughout the Dismal Swamp.

I knew you were in a city but in Orlando bears do not read boundary signs.. And near New York City bears don't either. I am still mad at my hubby.. he drove my new car to New Jersey about 12 min from Manhattan and almost totalled vs a bear. 350 lb male.. coming out of a diner parking lot Even though that was some 8 years ago I like to bring it up when its convenient!

I don't see many bears here though even though we have quite a healthy population of Blackies.. The last was a few years ago at the bank of mailboxes up the street. Must have had a food order in from Harry and David.

The advice to keep a clean camp is only half the battle. Don't pick an abused camp cause bears are creatures of habit and have a route. Look for evidence of careless fish cleaning.
I have seen many bears ( probably one per trip) which gives me great joy as I see them from the canoe or on the portage being bear doing bear things. Not in camp.. In Glacier NP we were advised that we had a bear in our camp.. ( there was no food around) but that was expected. The campsite was a car campsite in the middle of....a berry patch.
I dug up our bangers for our trip to Alaska and BC but where the spray is I have no idea..
Have you decided on your food carrying method? The canisters do carry about 2-3 nights but more nights require more canisters.

I think Turtle uses Ursacks and has tripped in the ADK's in bear country.

 

[BWCA66]

I actually live in Raleigh city limits. We rarely get any kind of bears this far in, and when they show up it makes the evening news. But they are all over the place down east and throughout the Dismal Swamp.

Yeah they are supposedly all over the BWCA too but in over 150 trips over 50 years I have only seen 5, only had 3 in camp and just 1 was a problem. Keep a clean camp and I too have carried firecrackers but now just take noisy grandkids.

 

[Magnus919]

So circling back around, assuming I've got my food packed away securely somewhere else, what size portage packs should I be looking at for 2-3 night trips?

 

[Waterdog]

I have a superior one from granite gear and it's well built and large. It would easily accommodate your gear. I carry either a 30 or 60L barrel for food, first aid and toiletries.

I have a lot of different size packs to match my trip requirements. If you're carrying your food in a barrel, your pack size going to depend on the kit you carry and the length of trip won't change that in my opinion.

So the superior one is a good size for you if you carry a lot of comfort items that take up space. I use mine for one nighters with a dog and luxury tent and sleeping gear.

It may be too big if you're using ultralight gear for portaging and covering ground. The GG packs and CCS packs have a lot of adjustment.

Are you packing like a canoe tripper or an ultralight back packer? Bearvaults would provide enough room for 3days and fit in a superior one for transport. I keep mine in camp too.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

I would take exactly the same things on a 2-3 night trip as for a 5-7 night trip except for the amount of food. Since all my food is commercial freeze dried, protein bars and snacks, the food doesn't add much volume. Neither does my kitchen, which is nothing more than a JetBoil stove, an insulated drinking mug, and a spork or spoon.

I've used essentially the same packing system for 30 years for solo trips: one Duluth pack with waterproof liner, one small waterproof backpack as a day bag, and more recently a heavy but comfortable bag chair. I used to carry no chair at all.

I don't have a real good picture of my packs, but you can see the green Duluth pack on the ground, the small roll-top day pack in front of it, and my bag chair under my hat. My three person tent is in its own waterproof stuff sack under the top flap of the Duluth. All my food is in an Ursack inside the Duluth. My 10x12 silnylon tarp and a bag full of ropes is in one pocket of my Duluth along with my folding saw, and my gravity water filter is inside the other pocket of my Duluth.

Here is a camp set up on the same trip. The tent it a three person Losi with both a factory fitted ground sheet and inside sheet. My gravity filter is set up on the tree. The Ursack with all my food for seven days is tied lower on the same tree. At night, I would tie the Ursack to a tree about 50 yards away from my tent. My packs go in the tent at night. I rarely use the tarp because, perhaps luckily, I usually just catch short showers and use my rain gear or sit in my big tent.

To lighten my load I'd get rid of the chair and could bring a smaller tent. With a hammock rig, you could fit that and a small fold-up chair like a Helinox inside a big pack easily. If I wanted to go out for two weeks, I still wouldn't take any different gear except to add more food. That would probably involve buying another Ursack. I like sacks and packs because, unlike barrels, they are light and collapse in volume as you use your food.

To calculate my pack volume (which I've never done before), my #3 Duluth Cruiser is 95 liters (5800 cubic inches):

My Seattle Sports day pack is 29.5 liters (1800 cubic inches), cost me $32 on sale at REI, and looks very similar to this later model version:

So, not counting my big chair, I can fit everything I need for two days or two weeks in 120 liters (7600 cubic inches) of packs.

I don't paddle any more in cold weather, but if I did and needed more room to take bulkier clothing, I might need to take a larger second pack instead of my Seattle Sports day pack, possibly my 76 liter (4650 cubic inches) GoLite Gust pack with a waterproof liner inside:

You don't really have to spend a lot of money if you're just going to trip occasionally. I see people in the Adirondacks carrying everything in garbage bags.

 

[Magnus919]

Thanks for taking the time to break that down and include photos. Super informative!

 

[flyingbison]

An alternative to barrels and bear vaults is a 5 gallon bucket with a gamma seal lid.

You can pick up the lids for under $10 at places like Home Depot, and they fit any standard 5-7 gallon plastic bucket, which should be plenty of space for 2-3 days worth of food on a solo trip. They are cheap, easy to carry, and easy to hang.


However ... I just ordered a used 8 gallon barrel from Ebay that is being delivered today, so maybe I will change my tune after trying our a barrel!

 

[yellowcanoe]

just a reminder. Barrels and buckets are a so so defense against bears. Better than nothing.. Barrels require a harness to be comfortable to carry. No way would I want to carry a duffel bag or a five gallon bucket on a long portage. Bears can get a hold of that latch on the barrel ( a cotter pin seems to deter coons)
Canisters are shaped the way they are for a reason. Bruin cannot get his mouth around them for a good purchase. Some canisters are not waterproof.. Barrels do float and are.. Gamma lids are until they aren't ( cross thread them a little or lose the O ring and you will see)

I am a little leery of buckets for another reason. Bears here are used to bear bait and they are in those buckets.

 

[flyingbison]

just a reminder. Barrels and buckets are a so so defense against bears. Better than nothing..

Absolutely. Outside of bear cannisters, everything else is just mitigating risk. For me, it's about finding the right balance of cost, convenience, and practicality for the environment. Black bears are present just about everywhere I camp, but very very rarely show themselves or create a problem. Racoons, rodents, porcupines, etc. are a much bigger nuisance.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

Here are two videos testing the Ursack and one after an unplanned Ursack attack. I suspect the test videos deliberately had food odors on the sack to attract the bears. In normal use, all food items are stored in odor proof Opsaks inside the Ursack. Plus, if all your food is in commercially sealed freeze dried packages, as mine all are, there should be no odors to attract the bear in the first place, as long as you keep odors off the outside of the Ursack.

Whole eggs may not survive a bear attack uncrushed, but if all your food is powdered or in tubes, the crushing of bear jaws shouldn't damage much. There is also an aluminum liner available from Ursack to minimize crushing. I don't use it because it adds 10.8 oz. and some bulk to the 7 oz. Ursack.

In comparison to the Ursack's 7 oz. weight, a 60L blue barrel weighs about 8 pounds, a 30L barrel about 4.5 pounds, and a barrel carrying harness, depending on model, about 2 pounds.

What you use depends upon your preferences for weight, bulk, crushability, collapsability, portagability, cost, and risk.

 

[Boreal Birch]

Don't forget that you are going to need a bear proof container for your Fountain Pen, you sure don't want to get ink all over the rest of your gear.

 

[southcove]

[
What you use depends upon your preferences for weight, bulk, crushability, collapsability, portagability, cost, and risk.

Nothing I have used over the years has ever really jumped out at me as a 'hallelueah' moment! (or a 'Eureka', cause I am pretty sure I got that one spelled correctly!) buckets, bags, Bills Bags, portage packs... but it always seems to work out okay in the end depending on the trip. (test)Pack it all up front a few nights before the trip, settle it in the canoe and then think about having to paddle it and carry it all around...

With bear containers, my own (round, yellow, screw in top) a few years ago got punted down the campsite access path, a good 50'+ one night, nearly ending up in the lake, a curious or hungry bruin. No way to really attach a rope to that brand. Another time all the food was put into one of the kayaks tied to the back of a boat on shore...the kayak owner nearly had a coronary the next morning when he found out what those arrangement were...in some areas bears are known to gnaw pretty seriously on plastic boats and rafts.

 

[clemency]

I'd only use a cannister where bears are habituated or there are no trees. Particularly with a hammock, you can cook in the campsite, sleep wherever you want, and hang food in a third location. And if you're going somewhere that bear hunting is common, well, they're going to be pretty skittish of people anyway.