Do you consider floatation bags necessary for tripping? Under what circumstances, canoe configurations? Do you tie down your packs in CI situations? Rely on packs for floatation?
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Floatation Bags
- Thread starter Black_Fly
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I don't own bags, although I do build floatation chambers into my strippers (even though they would float swamped without them). I might consider bags if I were to start tackling C3+ on a regular basis but that would limit space for gear which is far more important to me. Instead, I'll portage anything that I should have bags for.
No, I don't tie gear in. Again, if it's that sketchy, I'll portage or get off the water.
Cardinal rule of solo tripping (and solo+ pup): Don't take unnecessary chances.
No, I don't tie gear in. Again, if it's that sketchy, I'll portage or get off the water.
Cardinal rule of solo tripping (and solo+ pup): Don't take unnecessary chances.
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I don't consider flotation bags necessary but useful in the right circumstances.
I own a set of flotation bags for dedicated whitewater play and plan to experiment with them to fill voids in my solo tripping outfit. For instance, if my bow is empty, why not fill it with a flotation bag?
My packs are all water tight and get lashed in during any trip, contributing buoyancy. I once lost a pack after swamping in the middle of a lake during a sudden gale and I spent the rest of the multi-week trip borrowing spares from my tripmates. I got along fine because it was summertime but I don't want to repeat the experience.
One of the downsides to lashing in gear is that the boat is unwieldy once swamped and more difficult to empty of water because the canoe + gear makes for a very heavy unit to handle. Flotation bags displace a lot of water weight and thereby make the boat far easier to handle and recover. For instance, a boat with buoyant packs and flotation bags might sit mostly up and out of the water, even while overturned. I've successfully paddled swamped boats to shore on river trips and it would have always been easier sitting up a little higher thanks to more buoyancy.
All that said, there are plenty of circumstances in which inflation bags are overkill, add nuisance and degrade the aesthetics of your outfit. Yellow flotation bags would look incongruous in the lovely wood canvas canoe's of @lowangle al or @Robin.
I own a set of flotation bags for dedicated whitewater play and plan to experiment with them to fill voids in my solo tripping outfit. For instance, if my bow is empty, why not fill it with a flotation bag?
My packs are all water tight and get lashed in during any trip, contributing buoyancy. I once lost a pack after swamping in the middle of a lake during a sudden gale and I spent the rest of the multi-week trip borrowing spares from my tripmates. I got along fine because it was summertime but I don't want to repeat the experience.
One of the downsides to lashing in gear is that the boat is unwieldy once swamped and more difficult to empty of water because the canoe + gear makes for a very heavy unit to handle. Flotation bags displace a lot of water weight and thereby make the boat far easier to handle and recover. For instance, a boat with buoyant packs and flotation bags might sit mostly up and out of the water, even while overturned. I've successfully paddled swamped boats to shore on river trips and it would have always been easier sitting up a little higher thanks to more buoyancy.
All that said, there are plenty of circumstances in which inflation bags are overkill, add nuisance and degrade the aesthetics of your outfit. Yellow flotation bags would look incongruous in the lovely wood canvas canoe's of @lowangle al or @Robin.
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Generally, I do not use flotation bags in standard CI situations, although I do have a couple of sets of bags for dedicated whitewater boats. However, I have been re-thinking my use of them and will probably start including them in certain situations. For instance, I may take some in my Phoenix or Starfire on the Buffalo River next Spring, simply because I’ll have the space, and because my boats are pretty enough that I don’t want to risk catastrophic pins if I somehow happen to go for a swim. They significantly reduce the risk of a wrap. I also would like to go out on the “big” rivers near me next year (Lower Missouri and Mississippi) in my Polaris and I may bag it to make re-entry easier, just in case. Also, having the extra buoyancy to cling to if a barge is passing anywhere in the vicinity would be appreciated I think. Recently a kayaker on the Mississippi down here got swamped due to a boat starting its engine too close and the sudden wake flipped the kayak unexpectedly. He thought he was far enough away, but it turned out he wasn’t. That being said, I don’t think most of the MR340 racers use float bags and are normally just fine without them. I guess I just figure if you have the room, why not? It’s not that big of a hassle and it’s fairly cheap insurance.
If there is class 2 or higher with the possibility of a loose swamped canoe getting pinned, there will be float bags. If I'm in the Coho on any water, there will be float bags (Kaz doesn't build in any flotation). I don't bother with float bags on flat water otherwise.
There are some small items that I always secure to the canoe, like fishing gear, but I usually don't secure anything large that doesn't add flotation. I generally set things up so that secured gear can be easily released.
There are some small items that I always secure to the canoe, like fishing gear, but I usually don't secure anything large that doesn't add flotation. I generally set things up so that secured gear can be easily released.
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Every year around this time of year I tell myself that I really should have flotation bags in my boat since if I do end up in the water it's immediately serious so anything that makes the boat easier to recover seems like a really good idea.
Is there a preferred brand? NRS?
Is there a preferred brand? NRS?
I have many sets of air bags, a number of my (used) canoes came with bags. I only use them in my playboat which is only for day paddling or an overnight trip where I don't have much gear.
For extended trips I have plenty of gear that will displace water (the whole point of air bags), my gear is always either attached to the boat or contained in my extra large flotation cages (which are used as gear cages). When I'm running larger rapids and especially it it involves big waves I will often take on water but when the water reaches the gunnels the amount of actual water is modest, if I remove the gear there is usually only 2 - 4 inches of water left in the boat.
For extended trips I have plenty of gear that will displace water (the whole point of air bags), my gear is always either attached to the boat or contained in my extra large flotation cages (which are used as gear cages). When I'm running larger rapids and especially it it involves big waves I will often take on water but when the water reaches the gunnels the amount of actual water is modest, if I remove the gear there is usually only 2 - 4 inches of water left in the boat.
Yeah. The Mohawk bags I have in my Vertige are far better than every other bags I've had or seen. Too bad they're no longer available. But these look like they might be just as good...
Air Bags - Fall Line Canoes
Fall Line Canoes air bags custom whitewater canoe C1 and kayaking gear
www.falllinecanoes.com
Most of what I I have are Palm, which are sometimes available on Amazon. They're okay, but I don't like the tiny twist valves on the fill tubes, and the dump calves are crudely and tend to leak. I seal those with latex balloon pieces, but I've been planning to cut them out and replace with whitewater raft grade valves.
Though you've heard otherwise, size does matter. Recped's XL14 is packed pretty tight with his tripping gear. My Moisie has quite a bit more room. And despite trying to fill the void with bags of booze, coolers of meat, croquet sets, and the bug hut, I still have space for an end air bag fore and aft. Since filling up to the gunnels is not an unheard of event on our trips, displacement is critical. And yes, everything's tied in. Better to chase one big package, than have to coral lots of little ones.
I've found the NRS bags wear out pretty quickly. The yellow Harmony bags hold up the best in my experience.
I've found the NRS bags wear out pretty quickly. The yellow Harmony bags hold up the best in my experience.
If my trip involves any WW, I use float bags. I was really surprised how low my composite boat floats and how much maneuverability is lost with just a bit of water, and how much of a rock it is when swamped compared to Royalex.
The safety against wraps and even just piece of mind is well worth it.
Don’t waste your money on vinyl bags.
I’ve been very happy with my Fall Line bags. They’re 3 or 4 yrs old, no leaks on my last 10 day trip.
I have 30+ inch bags, still room for two 70/65L dry packs for gear (strapped in w/ quick release buckles)
The safety against wraps and even just piece of mind is well worth it.
Don’t waste your money on vinyl bags.
I’ve been very happy with my Fall Line bags. They’re 3 or 4 yrs old, no leaks on my last 10 day trip.
I have 30+ inch bags, still room for two 70/65L dry packs for gear (strapped in w/ quick release buckles)
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Don't remember how I heard about them, but I have ordered two sets of float bags from BPM out of the UK. Heavy weight single layer nylon bags. Raft valve is standard, top up valve is an option. Not cheap, and not sure how easy it would be to order them now with the changes Trump made on tariffs for small value imported items. I have them in my whitewater solo boats.
My river boat is an old Mohawk Whitewater 16. It has bench seats, but is set up with knee pads, thigh straps, bow, stern and center bags. The straps and the center bag aren't in very often, but I don't bother taking out the 30" bow and stern bags. I can tell you from experience that 30" bow and stern bags in a 16' foot boat don't guarantee that the boat won't pin. This is also my poling boat, and I stepped out in about a foot of water and ended up with the boat wrapped around a rock. It took four of us about 3 hours to get it unpinned. Good news is that it is royalex, so one foot stomp and it popped back into shape.
Coincidentally, this video showed up on Facebook this morning.
www.facebook.com
Never seen a solo recovery done that way. Seems to work well with two big bags in the boat. Not sure how it would work with heavy drybags loaded with gear. I guess this would work to get a loaded boat turned over, but I don't think it will come up empty. At least it would be upright. Can't imagine how long it would take to pump or bail out the boat, but maybe you could swim, or paddle or tow the swamped boat to shore.
My river boat is an old Mohawk Whitewater 16. It has bench seats, but is set up with knee pads, thigh straps, bow, stern and center bags. The straps and the center bag aren't in very often, but I don't bother taking out the 30" bow and stern bags. I can tell you from experience that 30" bow and stern bags in a 16' foot boat don't guarantee that the boat won't pin. This is also my poling boat, and I stepped out in about a foot of water and ended up with the boat wrapped around a rock. It took four of us about 3 hours to get it unpinned. Good news is that it is royalex, so one foot stomp and it popped back into shape.
Coincidentally, this video showed up on Facebook this morning.
97 reactions · 15 shares | A Self Rescue is such an important part of our padding skills set! Having the skills to independently sort myself out is a massive must for me. I’m not the strongest person out there, but as shown, it’s not all about str
A Self Rescue is such an important part of our padding skills set! Having the skills to independently sort myself out is a massive must for me. I’m not the strongest person out there, but as...
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Never seen a solo recovery done that way. Seems to work well with two big bags in the boat. Not sure how it would work with heavy drybags loaded with gear. I guess this would work to get a loaded boat turned over, but I don't think it will come up empty. At least it would be upright. Can't imagine how long it would take to pump or bail out the boat, but maybe you could swim, or paddle or tow the swamped boat to shore.
I've never used them on a trips or tied my packs down on C2 rivers. I do tether the packs together with a rope though so I don't loose anything if I flip. I have tied my packs down on big lakes to displace water in case I swamp. This is what Bill Mason recommended, and it worked great for me the one and only time I flipped in a rapid. I threw the packs out, emptied the water and reloaded without ever making it to shore.
