Saving Another RX Penobscot 16

[vwaffe]

Quick intro post (Hey, how are all y'all?) and looking for advice on which repairs you'd do on this Royalex Penobscot 16 I just picked up, so here goes:

Hey There: I've had to itch to get back on the water for the last few years since moving back to the east where there is a lot more than out west. It's been over 20 years, but I grew up in canoes... BWCA a few times, plus solo/tandem overnights exploring creeks and rivers closer to home in the midwest. I'm a mechanical engineer and my real passion is fixing/learning to fix just about anything...so I was never going to just go buy a new or "finished" boat. It was build or fix, and I definitely don't have the time to build just yet, so...

The Rescue: After watching the ads on CL anf FB for the last few years, the right boat finally came up - an Old Town Penobscot 16 in Royalex that needs a some TLC but is ready to paddle now (at least the seller thought so.)

I paid $120 for it. No punctures through to the inside (well, one... but it's within a half inch of the gunwale. The price was right, the hull was right, I've got space to store it in a heated garage, and will find some time to work on it after I finish a few other things this weekend.

Priorities before using:

1. Double-check/re-do the biggest, ugliest Gator Patch on the stern that's at or below waterline.
   • It looks like someone took a torch to the surface since the spot it's covering looks round and the vinyl is bubbled away a tiny bit next to the patch.
   • There's one tiny spot on the edge of that patch where I can't tell if it's showing foam core or just a rough spot from prep.
   • The hull shows no signs of delamination anywhere
2. G-Flex the one ding that looks like it might have broken the outer layer.
3. Scrub it down, scrub the mold off, and hit it with 303

Soon as time allows:

1. Replace gunwales and un-twist the hull
   • It was stored on its side in a community boat rack and something bent it and broke the gunwales diagonally across the center of the boat from each other.
   • Although the seller brought it back to general symmetry about the long centerline, it's still twisted a little about the long axis.
     • On my roof rack before snugging the straps down, on gunwale had about 1/2" of air under it. Snugging the straps (not hard) brought it level.
   • The port gunwale is cracked completely through near the front seat attachment point and the seller did a quick repair by bolting an aluminum doubler plates to the inboard side of the gunwale.
     • I wish it didn't have those 4 extra holes near the sheer, but oh well.
     • The hull is still too wide at the front seat - visible in the photos.
   • The starboard gunwale is cracked on the outside at the rivet closest to the rear thwart.
   • I'm debating between aluminum replacements and going whole hog on wood
     • Aluminum would be a straight replacement,
       • I've read here and elsewhere that they don't come pre-formed any more and getting them on and shaped can be a pain.
       • Haven't called OT yet to ask about replacements, but the seller did. He just didn't want to wait for them to ship to the closest dealer.
     • If I went with wood, I would use mahogany, ash, or a combo of them both along with new deck plates, etc. That would Make her look pretty!
     • Not too worried about cold cracks since it'll be stored indoors, but I'll admit that concern is a factor.
       • This hull is pretty clean - no cracks, minor warp, and some basic scrapes from handling and community lake use. Well, that and what I think is one bullet hole just under the gunwale - it's a hole with the flap of hull still attached inside the boat, consistent with the size of the five other uniformly round dents near it.
   • If I take the bent and broken gunwales off, will the hull straighten back out on its own if I lay it upside down on level supports and leave it out in the sun one hot day this summer, perhaps weighted down evenly just enough to get it to settle back?
2. Re-cane the seats
   1. The frames look fine, but the dowels have rotted and need to be replaced
3. Put a regular rear thwart back in
   1. The rear portage yoke makes no sense.

This is what it looks like; haven't touched it yet other than to bring it home and put it in the garage.

HIN XTC80619H102 - Manufactured August 2001 for Model Year 2002?

Ad picture 1. Port gunwale repair visble.


Ad picture 2: Hull twist and misshapen gunwales easily visible, seats wrapped in rope. Second portage yoke as rear thwart... odd.


Honey, look what I bought!! (My wife does not understand...)


Inside is clean as a whistle. Rotted dowels and widened front hull obvious.


This spot is the ugliest one and I'm not sure what's going on with bubbled part of the vinyl. Want to scrape/sand/pull this off to re-do it with a smoother patch to be certain. The hull is solid here - no squish, no change in tone when tapped. No sign of damage on the inside.


One sharp-edged ding that looks like it cut through the outer layer... G-Flex?


Another ugly repair but it looks like it was pinched/cut by something. No sign of damage on the inside.


What made these round dents? Guessing someone shot it. There are six in total. The one under the patch goes through, and there's one patch ahead of this on a spot that didn't puncture the inside but left an indentation.


Crack in starboard gunwale at the rear thwart:


Field expdient repair to the port gunwale (aluminum backer plate on the inside, stainless bolts)

 

[Steve in Idaho]

Welcome to the forum!

First off, the Penobscot 16 is one of my favorite royalex canoes and worth bringing back to usable shape.

I repaired one years ago that actually looked worse than that, other than your gunwales. Mine was only cracked on one side, and since the crack was only halfway through, I patched it with JB Weld on an experimental basis - and that actually held for as long as I had it, which was quite a while.

Mine had a spot on the floor that was bubbled up. Looked to me like someone left a puddle of acetone there long enough to do that damage. I ignored it, and it was never a problem. On yours, I would remove all those ugly patches and patch whatever needs patched with fiberglass and g-flex epoxy. You could either paint it afterwards or mix some pigment (I like to use graphite powder) into the epoxy for UV protection.

I would simply ignore the little dents and holes near the shear they will never be a problem. I deliberately drill holes in that area for floatation bag cages. The cordage doesn't plug those numerous holes, but I never give it another thought.

My Penobscot also was twisted like yours. Because the royalex was too old and "cured" (baked, actually ) to correct that, I just lived with it. And ya know? It was a little annoying, but I never noticed it having a negative effect on paddling it. YMMV, but you might want to paddle it a bit before you get involved in trying to correct that. My expectation is that since all royalex canoes are now too old to still be soft and somewhat pliable, I think it's unlikely that you will be able to change that much. I could be wrong, about that. But if you're lucky, maybe it will straighten out some with the gunwales replaced.

Since your seat hangers are shot anyway and will be replaced, I would make truss style hangers. That will be stronger and less squeaky. If the seat frames are still good, you have several options to bring them up to snuff. I like to use cordage for a Belgian chair weave. You can probably Google that.

 

[Steve in Idaho]

Others will be along with advice about gunwale replacement. That's something I haven't had to do yet.

 

[jdeerfoot]

Great deal for the price.

 

[Robin]

That’s a very good deal, nice canoe.I prefer wood gunnels, lots of wood options and availability on places like Facebook marketplace and Craigslist. Those decks need to go…imho, haha Replace the rope with webbing on the seats.
I’m not sure about those patches, but GFlex is a great product.
Good luck with the resto, and please follow up with some pics and stories.

 

[ppine]

Good canoes deserve to be saved.
I would just live with the gunwales.
Perfect rock boat.

 

[CaptainOllieWest]

Welcome. I have a Penobscot project too. Mine is a 17. It has been on the back burner, but hopefully I will get some time to work on it soon.

 

[Gamma1214]

Welcome. I wouldn't have passed it up at that price either. As for repairs: I'd G-flex the one hole that looks like it went through (near waterline, not the bullet hole at the sheer), repair the seats and replace the gunwales. I wouldn't get real excited about the rest of the cosmetics.

From the upside down picture, it looks like the seat drops may be contributing to the seat being out of alignment so you may want to replace the drops with some that provide more stability. This would probably be easier with wood gunwales and you'd likely have a better chance of reshaping the hull with wood. (Besides, wood just looks better so unless you're a gram-weenie...)

Royalex boats tend to be heavy beasts so the weight of Ash or Mahogany might not be an issue but, if you did want to save a few ounces (and a few bucks) Yellow (aka Tulip) Poplar might be a good option for the trim. The color would complement the hull nicely and you can probably find a sawmill to cut full length boards and avoid scarf joints.

It's certainly no shame to paddle it pretty close to "as is" but, personally, I hope you try to pull it back to the original shape as I'm curious about methodology and what kind of result you can achieve.

 

[vwaffe]

Thanks for the replies and encouragement. I'm definitely in the camp of "let's try to get this back to as good as possible.”

@Steve in Idaho thanks for the tip on truss style hangers and the idea of pigmenting the G-Flex. I've since delved deeper into the product line and discovered all the various additives... Really cool stuff.

On hull repairs, has anyone ever used auto wrap or hobby vinyl as a top layer instead of painting? I'm thinking of filling any deep damage in that one spot with thickened, reinforced epoxy to a little below the finished contour, then adding a thin, sandable skim coat (like body filler), smoothing it to blend, then putting a vinyl patch on top with a skim coat of G-Flex as adhesive instead of painting it. Not going for an invisible repair, but something that looks better than the existing Gator Patches.

@Robin and @Gamma1214, I'm leaning toward wood but will have to figure out where to source it. I've got nothing against scarf joints but it would be cool to use single pieces. I'll look into yellow poplar too. I think you're right that it might be easier to pull the hull back to the right width with wood. The way it is now, the front still needs to come together a few inches so the seat fits correctly in between the sides (that's why the front seat hangers look funny; the hull is a bit spread there.)

I'm not a gram weenie (I grew up portaging my grandfather's 17' aluminum Sylvan that we affectionately called The Battleship, hefting it onto full size van roof racks, and hanging it from the garage ceiling on static chains without a hoist. That thing weighed about 90#. By comparison, Royalex is really light! I'm ok to add a few pounds to this one for the look and repairability of wood. If I ever want a featherweight canoe I'll go buy a Hornbeck

I don't know of any reason that ABS can't be re-thermoformed; in fact it's one of the best plastics for it... my notion is to get it just warm enough to take a new set. I have an idea to make a solar "oven" using lath and plastic sheeting (like a greenhouse) over boat out on the driveway on a sunny day to warm it up gently while weighing it down upside down from the gunwales onto a set of platforms at the right station heights to get rid of the warp while pulling the sides together to the right dimensions, then hold it there while it cools.

If the rest works out, I am intrigued by the contoured cane seats on offer by Ed's Canoe and others...a bucket seat for the back and a contour one for the front (where you'd sit backwards in solo mode) would be dope.

Cheers all! I'll post updates as this progresses.