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New Swift Prospector 15 Solo - Specs?
- Thread starter Moonman
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I had a very productive phone conversation with Bill Swift today. He let me know that there will be a multitude of seat options available for the P15S and that the base seat pod height target will likely be around 10", with other options being pack seats and gunnel-hung seats for lower and higher options.
Bill said that they will absolutely do gunnel-hung on the integral carbon/kevlar gunnels, but it needs to be specified at time of order because they do a slightly different layup process to add strength. This would obviously allow the height to be set wherever you please, starting at around 12" from the floor if I am reading the spec correctly.
Speaking of strength, if you are a heavier paddler like me, Swift will do a "robust" build for $200 that includes a beefier rib system and seat. I alluded to wanting to trade some of their renowned light weight for layup strength, and he indicated that doing so was certainly possible as a custom order.
If I can get a P15S in an Expedition "Plus" epoxy layup, with big boy seating hung at 11" on solid rib structure. . . . It might be the one. Definitely expensive, but might be darn near perfect for my intended usage. Ruby exterior with cherry trim, comingle interior and Red Leaf outfitting: mmmm. . . . Gonna have to pick up a side job or three. . .
Bill said that they will absolutely do gunnel-hung on the integral carbon/kevlar gunnels, but it needs to be specified at time of order because they do a slightly different layup process to add strength. This would obviously allow the height to be set wherever you please, starting at around 12" from the floor if I am reading the spec correctly.
Speaking of strength, if you are a heavier paddler like me, Swift will do a "robust" build for $200 that includes a beefier rib system and seat. I alluded to wanting to trade some of their renowned light weight for layup strength, and he indicated that doing so was certainly possible as a custom order.
If I can get a P15S in an Expedition "Plus" epoxy layup, with big boy seating hung at 11" on solid rib structure. . . . It might be the one. Definitely expensive, but might be darn near perfect for my intended usage. Ruby exterior with cherry trim, comingle interior and Red Leaf outfitting: mmmm. . . . Gonna have to pick up a side job or three. . .
Update:
I went to Swift's demo day at Rutabaga yesterday and paddled the P15 Solo.
Double blade, beaver tail, and bent shaft, the craft was pleasant to paddle. I actually much preferred the single blades over the double, which is not always the case with the boats I have paddled.
The good:
This boat paddles great. Just me or loaded with an extra couple water bags, it was a VERY pleasurable paddling experience. I was very surprised at how well it tracked, given how easily I could slip around the dock corners. Hit-and-switch style, it was not difficult to get 5-6 strokes on a side without undue yaw. The P15S definitely doesn't pivot like my SuperNova, but, well, not much does.
They had demo boats with multi-pods, regular pods, and pack seats. I paddled the multi-pod the most, with the seat on "high". This put the bottom of the front seat rail 8.25" above the center and the top of the rear rail right at 10". This was a good height for kneeling and sitting. I could stand for it to be another 1/2" or so higher, but it was infinitely better than the Canoecopia version. The low setting takes it down to about 4" under the front and 5.5" on top of the rear. This makes the boat CRAZY stable. felt like my Tripper, almost. If you plan to use the low setting, just buy the "tall" version of their pack seats. Its way more comfortable. If I order this canoe, I will ask for the multi-pod setup without the lower pods. I appreciated how much stiffer the multi-pod system made the tumblehome. It was quite noticeable over the standard pod setup. Picture to show structure:
The standard pod setup put the front seat rail about 6.5" above the floor. Skinnier people than me might find this preferable. I did not.
The layups were gorgeous, as expected. Fit and finish were perfect. Swift was delivering a lot of customer boats, so you could see lots of different finsh and trim combinations. Which brings me to...
The not-as-good-as-hoped:
While looking at the P15S, the Dragonfly15, and the P14 side by side, it was apparent that the P15S was the shallowest of the three. Which was odd to me, since the specs on the website have the P15S as 14" center shear. Looking further, there was also a difference in shear between the gunwale systems, with carbon/kevlar being deeper than aluminum and cherry. I measured the shear at the yoke point via tape and straight edge.
Dragonfly15 carbon/kevlar: 13.5"
P14 carbon/kevlar: 12.25"
P15S carbon/kevlar: 12.25"
P15S aluminum or cherry: 11.25"
This was not a pleasant surprise for a boat that is listed as 14" and typed as a river boat.
I talked to Bill about this and he said that the gunwale discrepancy is typical across all boats. As far as the 14" spec, he said they would change the website. I told him it was glad I had not ordered a $6k, 14" deep cherry-trim boat at Canoecopia, as nearly 3" of difference would have resulted in a delivery refusal. As it is, I will have to do some research. Esquif recently added 1.5" to their Echo just so it would be a better river boat. (Echo 2.0)
All-in-all, it was a great day. The P15S is a great boat. I dont know if I will buy one with an 11.25" center depth. It has LOTS of buoyancy, which leaves a good bit freeboard. Me and 80 pounds of water were probably only drafting 2.5-3".
I guess I will wait and see what Northstar cooks up. Rumor has it that they are giving the burly solo a second shot in 2026 after scrapping their 2025 effort.
I went to Swift's demo day at Rutabaga yesterday and paddled the P15 Solo.
Double blade, beaver tail, and bent shaft, the craft was pleasant to paddle. I actually much preferred the single blades over the double, which is not always the case with the boats I have paddled.
The good:
This boat paddles great. Just me or loaded with an extra couple water bags, it was a VERY pleasurable paddling experience. I was very surprised at how well it tracked, given how easily I could slip around the dock corners. Hit-and-switch style, it was not difficult to get 5-6 strokes on a side without undue yaw. The P15S definitely doesn't pivot like my SuperNova, but, well, not much does.
They had demo boats with multi-pods, regular pods, and pack seats. I paddled the multi-pod the most, with the seat on "high". This put the bottom of the front seat rail 8.25" above the center and the top of the rear rail right at 10". This was a good height for kneeling and sitting. I could stand for it to be another 1/2" or so higher, but it was infinitely better than the Canoecopia version. The low setting takes it down to about 4" under the front and 5.5" on top of the rear. This makes the boat CRAZY stable. felt like my Tripper, almost. If you plan to use the low setting, just buy the "tall" version of their pack seats. Its way more comfortable. If I order this canoe, I will ask for the multi-pod setup without the lower pods. I appreciated how much stiffer the multi-pod system made the tumblehome. It was quite noticeable over the standard pod setup. Picture to show structure:
The standard pod setup put the front seat rail about 6.5" above the floor. Skinnier people than me might find this preferable. I did not.
The layups were gorgeous, as expected. Fit and finish were perfect. Swift was delivering a lot of customer boats, so you could see lots of different finsh and trim combinations. Which brings me to...
The not-as-good-as-hoped:
While looking at the P15S, the Dragonfly15, and the P14 side by side, it was apparent that the P15S was the shallowest of the three. Which was odd to me, since the specs on the website have the P15S as 14" center shear. Looking further, there was also a difference in shear between the gunwale systems, with carbon/kevlar being deeper than aluminum and cherry. I measured the shear at the yoke point via tape and straight edge.
Dragonfly15 carbon/kevlar: 13.5"
P14 carbon/kevlar: 12.25"
P15S carbon/kevlar: 12.25"
P15S aluminum or cherry: 11.25"
This was not a pleasant surprise for a boat that is listed as 14" and typed as a river boat.
I talked to Bill about this and he said that the gunwale discrepancy is typical across all boats. As far as the 14" spec, he said they would change the website. I told him it was glad I had not ordered a $6k, 14" deep cherry-trim boat at Canoecopia, as nearly 3" of difference would have resulted in a delivery refusal. As it is, I will have to do some research. Esquif recently added 1.5" to their Echo just so it would be a better river boat. (Echo 2.0)
All-in-all, it was a great day. The P15S is a great boat. I dont know if I will buy one with an 11.25" center depth. It has LOTS of buoyancy, which leaves a good bit freeboard. Me and 80 pounds of water were probably only drafting 2.5-3".
I guess I will wait and see what Northstar cooks up. Rumor has it that they are giving the burly solo a second shot in 2026 after scrapping their 2025 effort.
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Sorry I missed you yesterday. The one I paddled had a fixed seat in high position and footbrsce and I really liked the boat a lot although it's not what I'm looking for at this time. I only had 185-190 in the boat. Bill told me he almost brought a Starfire; I'm sorry he didn't for your sake although I think a Swift Starfire would make me drool.
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Haha, I should have put a post up on here. We had to have seen each other unless you got there after 3p or in and out while I was at lunch. I was the biggest guy with green pants, a black hoodie, and a mustache. I'm actually not confident you dont have my legs in the top right of your photo, but I dont remember holding anything except my paddles... the legs look skinny, too
I had asked Bill about bringing a Starfire back at Canoecopia, but he apparently didn't remember. I dont fault him for that.
Well, sorry I missed ya!
I agree, the Starfire is worth a shot for @Tryin'
And they are awfully purdy no matter the make.
Although perhaps still not deep enough for him. I think the Swift version seems shallower than the Bell version’s 13.5” but haven’t measured them side by side.
Seems pretty dry to me in smaller class II though.
Caribou S is rated at 14” so might be an alternative.
Thanks! I’ve been very happy with it. And I do think you’d like the design. Unfortunately in the Ozarks they don’t stay pristine very long:
I got the epoxy “beefy” Expedition Kevlar to run lower water, or Class II with big rocks. Mostly to save the gel coat on my Bell. The Starfire may be the best design ever made for Ozark streams. The Bell is more “spinny”, and slightly deeper (which I prefer), but the Swift can take bigger impacts, and was pulled in an inch from the factory so it tracks a little better but is still very maneuverable.
The Prospector 15S seems like a great boat, and looks fantastic, but that depth is a shame and I wish it had more rocker.
I am surprised to see references to a difference in dimensions between Swift and Bell StarFIREs - does anyone know if this holds true for the WildFIRE as well? My Swift WildFIRE feels a bit more playful than did my Bell (but the Bell I had was an early white-gold layup, and from what I have read from Charlie, the core mat used in those earlier white-gold boats tended to flatten the bottom and make them handle a bit differently from the black-gold and later white-gold boats). I had assumed the more playful nature of the Swift was because of the core mat in my older Bell, but now I am wondering if there are other differences...
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Well, sort of. When discussing the build and that it would be set up as a solo, Bill asked if I wanted it pulled in to be better as a solo setup (easier reach over the gunwales). To my knowledge they’ve only made two Starfires, and I think they did that with the first one. I told him no, and to keep it as the original Bell spec’d 30” at the gunwales because I didn’t want less rocker. Then I discovered my Bell is actually wider than the original spec by an inch at 31”, which explains why it’s so “spinny”. Its gunwales have been replaced and I think it was probably inadvertently widened when they were replaced (happy accident for me as I love how it handles). Once I got my Swift I realized it was a little narrower (maybe it was only a half inch instead of a full inch, can’t remember for sure, but it was definitely narrower) but I don’t know if it was a miscommunication or just a function of how the wood gunwales came out. Either way I figured if I didn’t like how it paddled I’d reach out to Swift for wider thwarts and a seat (hopefully at their expense) and redo it myself. As it turned out I liked how it paddled (still plenty “turny” but tracks just a slight bit better), and widening it would reduce the center depth which already feels less than the Bell so I decided to keep it as is. The differences are fairly subtle and both boats are pretty stellar to me. The main thing is you can stop paddling the Swift and you have maybe 2-4 seconds before it yaws off course or you have to paddle/correct. In the Bell, you have to paddle and correct constantly, zero seconds before yaw. Subtle, but both are great. “Almost-sort of” leaning towards whitewater playboat-ish handling but with the more traditional touring aesthetic. That’s an exaggeration, but they are far and away the most maneuverable boats I’ve paddled short of WW playboats, especially when compared to other “touring river boats” like the Phoenix, SRT, Prospector 15, etc.
Yes. The DF15 is a very fun paddle. It is significantly more lively than the P15S, with a rounder, narrower hull.
It had more primary stability than my SuperNova, but less secondary. Shallower radius, but less chord, if that makes sense. It dumped at least one paddler on Saturday, maybe two. The DF15 will perform best for active paddlers. That is not to say it is unruly, but requires more attention. Like when you turn off your alarm in the morning and lay there for a minute, wary against falling back asleep, but not really awake. The P15S is like hitting the snooze button: get up and go or return to sleep for 5 minutes, it will be there for you either way.
If I weighed 200-220#, it would be very high on my WTB list. But I don't.
Man, I really need to find a way to try a D15. I wonder if there will be any place that I can do that while I'm in Minnesota.
Here's one more suggestion for your "linebacker" solo: a Vermont Canoe Indy.
This would be a hard canoe to find (Vermont Canoe wasn't around very long!), and the depth at center is a little shallower and the waterline a little narrower than your ideal (29" is the 4" waterline), but otherwise I think it meets nearly all your specs. (I assume the gunwale width is a typo, as the spec on the Mad River Independence—which, if I understand correctly, came from the same mold and was just cut down 1" more—is 28.5". Mad River specified the Independence as having an ideal load range of ~150–350 lbs, though I don't know how heavy a load it takes to sink it to the 3" waterline; I have one and find it pretty fun and lively unloaded despite its length, and it carries a tripping load well, but I probably haven't loaded it past ~250 lbs myself.)
That all said, if the Swift Shearwater and Dragonfly 15 aren't the right fits for you (as discussed previously), perhaps the Indy wouldn't be either, considering how similar its specs are.
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The mad river indypendence never occured to me as a river boat and never as a boat good fot 200 pound plus. There is not much secondary stability bevore i burry teh gunnel 2 inches under water. Then it sinks rather quickly. And i am 160 ish i thnik 80 ish kilo is more what i see on the scales over here. Over here it is regarded as a good boat due to the lack of high sides and bow.. it slices waves nicely. ..
The vermont version i never seen.
The vermont version i never seen.
I definitely wouldn't call the Independence a river boat, but I think it would be about as capable on a river as most similar solo tripping canoes. Its biggest problem is, like you say, that it slices through waves, which is great on a windy lake but means you'd have to be pretty careful to avoid swamping in class II whitewater. I kneel in mine and find the secondary stability excellent, but my experience with it has been as a person weighing ~80–100 kilos, and I imagine it could start to become unstable with twice that weight (I once tried paddling it as a tandem with my brother just to see how it would work, and even with both of us kneeling, it felt pretty sketchy). It also doesn't firm up progressively to the limit when heeled the way some of the DY-designed solos do, so it is easy to find yourself taking a surprise swim if you try putting the gunwale in the water.
