Making a Composite/Carbon Paddle

[Alasgun]

[Admin Note: This is a thread I've split off from Alasgun's "Evolution of an Alaskan DipShip" thread so that his postings and pictures of how he is building a composite/carbon paddle can be centralized in a separate thread. I will first populate it with the paddle-related posts from that other thread, and then further discussion of the paddle project can continue here. - Glenn MacGrady]

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With my butchering behind me i’m back on the dip-ship. Today i got started on a paddle and in about an hour had the blade roughed in and the pieces that will make up the shaft glue-lamed. The tools used are shown minus the jig saw. One 2x2x1 piece of pink board easily makes a canoe paddle. Once the foam form is done it will be covered with a variety of materials starting with a couple layers of e-glass sleeve and a layer of carbon/kevlar fabric on the blade portion followed by 1 or 2 layers of full length carbon sleeve. The layup schedule is based entirely on the strength I achieve as i go along and i’ll quit when it’s “right”. The bottom 8 inches of the blade will be trimmed with carbon/kevlar sleeve. I really like the sleeve material for finishing any thin edge because the sleeve material already has a clean, defined edge and by splitting the sleeve on the other crease it’s pretty easy to do passable edge hardening.

 

[memaquay]

I have never seen a paddle built like this before, really look forward to its evolution.

 

[Alasgun]

@memaquay, it’s easier for me to build a section at a time and glue those sections together as i go. There’s not really any strength to the foam board; it’s simply a form to give shape to the laminating materials. I guess you could add economy in there as well; around here a half sheet of 1 1/2 inch is pushing $40.00. A 2x2x1 sheet it $6.00! I believe i get a more symmetrical paddle doing it in sections as well. Trying to work thru a one piece, 65 inch long paddle would give me fits. I’ve seen, on line a fellow who cnc machines forms for the greenland style paddles all in one piece; that’s different, im operating manual equipment. Cnc folks would spend the time making tooling and a program then be able to make literally 1,000 of paddles in very little time. I can’t stand to make two of anything; once i’ve conquered it i like to move on!

Today i machined the glue lamed foam to a uniform shape on one side then set the mill up like a router and finished the loom. You don’t get much perspective from the picture but the shape is oval with the palm side having the smaller radius, the originals are described as egg shaped.
It’s now glued to the blade and the grip section will be last. From this point on i’ll be borrowing heavily from the Aleutian kayak paddle design. I like several elements of those and will incorporate them into a single blade Paddle.

 

[jffdejongh]

Today i machined the glue lamed foam to a uniform shape on one side then set the mill up like a router and finished the shaft. You don’t get much perspective from the picture but the shape is oval with the palm side having the smaller radius.
It’s now glued to the blade and the grip section will be next. From this point on i’ll be borrowing heavily from the Aleutian kayak paddle design. I like several elements of those and will incorporate them into my single blade paddle.

That's awesome to Machine foam like that!

 

[Alasgun]

Thanks @jffdejongh, so far im batting 1’000 but i can see where you’d throw a bunch away due to breakage. It’s pretty rigid in whole sheets but in thin sections, get’s real wimpy real fast. Once i get even one layer of the laminating materials over the whole form; it becomes very solid.

 

[memaquay]

Last year I spent a bucket load of dough on a carbon paddle, so I'm quite interested to see yours take shape. I've built lots of wooden paddles, but I'm not sure I would have the skills to attempt one of these.

 

[Alasgun]

@memaquay Anyone could do this; i’m certainly not a master at anything but compromise! Pick an epoxy, i use west system; go on line, even ebay and discover all the raw materials out there. Don’t get too hung up on the real exotic stuff or all the talk about infusion, vacuum bagging etc.; i’m strictly a “hand layup guy”.
Beyond that fool around with shaping the foam, all the tools you’d use making wooden paddles will work fine and the foam won’t dullen any of them.
Look at all the “sleeve materials” fiberglass, carbon and kevlar; they’re what make it easy. They’ll expand or contract like Chinese handcuff’s, taking the shape of you form and looking good along the way!
Factory carbon paddles are virtually perfect and from the right supplier pretty strong as well. They’re considerably lighter than anything else too. By making your own you can use mostly glass, giving some flex then once over with carbon or kevlar or, or, or! Besides, traditionally shaped factory paddles are pretty scarce. I’m pretty sure our forefathers would have used this technology back in the day, combining they’re purity of form and our technology just seems logical. Kinda like what most are doing when we pick anything other than a birch bark!

Don't be put off by the mill/lathe’s in my pictures. I use them because i have them, ALL of this can be done with hand tools. I’m probably the laziest person you’d ever meet and the mill saves me a lot of time when shaping stuff like this.

 

[Alasgun]

Thanks for looking out for me Glenn, pretty much everything i do is DIY, so i’m honored to hang out with that group!

Today i roughed in the grip and got it fastened to the shaft. After finishing the transitions at the two joints, i’ll be able to start hardening this noodle!

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

Factory carbon paddles are virtually perfect and from the right supplier pretty strong as well. They’re considerably lighter than anything else too. By making your own you can use mostly glass, giving some flex then once over with carbon or kevlar or, or, or! Besides, traditionally shaped factory paddles are pretty scarce.

Factory carbon paddles are very expensive. When you're finished, I'm sure everyone here would be interested in an estimate of the money and time it cost you to make your own.

 

[Cruiser]

Interesting .... >.< just what i need, another project

 

[memaquay]

The hamster wheel in my head is turning pretty fast right now, lol.

 

[Alasgun]

Here we go!
Yesterday i had grooved the power side of the blade and used g-flex and a fiberglass driveway delineator to add a spine to one side of the blade.
Today, everything got the first layer of glass and another will be added tomorrow. Between layers a profuse amount of sanding will take place; for a couple reasons. 1. If there’s any “snags” they will give you fits with the next layer. 2. Any un-wanted inclusions won’t go away or just get covered up with the next layer’s but instead those bo-boo’s will continue to grow with each layer.
As i mentioned previously “i’ll quit when it feels right”; but the tentative plan is another layer of glass over-all then a layer of carbon/kevlar cloth over the blade followed by a full length carbon sleeve over everything. Lastly the lower edge will be trimmed with carbon/kevlar.
3 complete layers of carbon would be quite rigid and maybe too much of a good thing; im hoping the glass before the carbon will give some flex.
Here’s some pictures of today's progress, shrink wrap helps keep stuff out of the wet glue; to my rear i was running the lathe sleeving the seal surfaces on a 4-wheeler hub and didn’t want any of the debris to find it’s way onto my paddle!

p.s when you look at the picture with the spine up, the shaft looks crooked to the blade and it is! Once i was sure all the glass was wetted and pulled the shrink wrap over the top; i stretched a string from the center of the grip to the blade tip and nudged the shaft back and forth, centering it before placing the sand bags.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

Maybe you said above, but what kind of foam are you using and where do you get it?

 

[Alasgun]

This is pink board from a box store but any of the insulation foam boards would work as long as epoxy won’t dissolve them. If you stick with pink or blue board you’ll be just fine. Both of these are denser than the white stuff and pretty easily worked with rudimentary hand tools.

 

[Alasgun]

The overall contour of this paddle was taken from a Fishell “Ray special” before i got geekey and combined elements from the Aleutian paddles. Like them I have a flat side and a side with the spine, my shaft is egg shaped and asymmetrical. lying on the bench one side is completely flat. The shaft diameter is 1 7/32 x 1 5/8 and will grow just a bit as layers are added. And of course, it’s all a composite layup and i’ll post the weight once it’s known.

”Whats the point”, why would you want something like this? Let’s start with the fact it will be full on Winter here until May 1st! Beyond that, being a tinkerer with a fertile imagination i’m compelled for some reason to jump into something like this on a whim.
A boss once told me “I had an interesting perspective on things” and i told him , if you always float down the river of life like everyone else, all you see is the smooth side of the rocks because the current polishes them. On the other hand, if you swim up stream, bucking the current you get to see where all the little bugs live and the fish that eat them. Im a strong swimmer and my life’s been pretty interesting as a result.

Is there any practical advantage, probably not but along the way i’ll end up with a double two and a half feather weight whiz bang paddle like no other on the water! And if it’s a piece of crap; i’ll gift it to someone on the bank and possibly build an improved version. Maybe; oh look; there’s a butterfly!

 

[memaquay]

Very interesting! I've never seen that sleeve type glass. I'm making an order soon for a canoe build, I'll have to ask my fiberglass guy about it.

 

[Woodpuppy]

The driveway delineator you used- I’m guessing this was a roughly 1/4” fiberglass stick like what I see in parking lots up north so the plows know where the curbs are? Why did you want a ridge on one side of the paddle? I’ve got bent shaft paddles, but except for hit and switch, I prefer playing with underwater recoveries and palm roll strokes. How does the asymmetric blade plane in the water?

I’ve got a 66” Ray Special as well, and it was heavier than I expected. I am considering taking the shaft to a belt sander to ovalize it. My Bruce Smith is slender and ovalized, and the paddle I just reworked is now also ovalized. It’s a nicer feel than round.

 

[Alasgun]

@memaquay, to my knowledge the sleeve material comes in fiberglass, carbon and a carbon/kevlar hybrid and pure kevlar. The expansion/contraction feature is it’s most appealing feature. As you can see on this one it’s not endless stretch but the glass sleeve for this project was bought sized for the shaft and the little bit of blade coverage is kind of icing. When i get to the carbon sleeve for the final outer cover; it was purchased with the full blade width in mind and i may have to get creative getting it down to the shaft diameter. It’s usually easy enough to just buy a couple sizes; making sure your whole project is uniform.

@Woodpuppy, yea the delineators come in 5/16 and 3/8 up here, guess i took it for granted that everyone has a big tube of them setting around in they’re box stores. I doubt folks in Florida need to mark the drive way edge so you can find it when plowing snow!! From what i’ve read, the ridge helps with the drip and also keeps the Aleutian paddles from fluttering during hard power strokes. I’m nearly twice as wide as those and at my age there aren’t too many “hard power strokes” so i doubt flutter would be a problem. I’ll be curious about helping keep a dryer boat?

I agree on the weight of “the special” which has a lot to do with this project. I’ve never bought anything but off the shelf paddles previously and got this one for the dip ship; then it showed up about as heavy as an aluminum snow shovel! I can fix that and have a nice pattern to use along the way.

Once the smoke clears, the “special” will find a new home and be somewhat unique in that it travelled half way around the world and back and never dipped it’s toe in the water!

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

”Whats the point”, why would you want something like this?

Over many decades on this and other canoe forums, paddlers from time to time have inquired about where to get carbon canoe paddles with blade shapes that are different from racing shapes, such as traditional beaver or otter tail shapes. There has never been a consistent commercial source for such paddles, and I don't recall offhand anyone making their own.

 

[Alasgun]

@Glenn MacGrady, when i penned “what’s the point” your comments were in my mind. It seems a sort of a conundrum to me that folks will clammer over the latest high tech craft and propel it with a hunk of lumber! Don’t get me wrong there are some exquisitely crafted paddles made by true craftsmen shown elsewhere in this sub forum. These are true art forms and highly desirable to some in paddledom; others might want something traditional in form but techie for any number of reasons. For older paddlers it could be the weight, or narrower profile both of which offer some level of shoulder comfort. I guess the paddle market analyst are all 19, fresh out of college folks who may be in the paddle making business simply because they like the smell of polyester, who knows. At any rate there’s a lot of room out there if someone would pursue it.

Those “racers” you mention understand all the attributes, and desire to have something that gives them an edge. Paddle makes must not see us as racers? I like to tell folks, “only my bones are old, im still a punk at heart.”