Clipper prospector 14 debate

[dutchlennart]

I guess a seperate topic is usefull.
3 reasons ;
If there was the best boat there should be more knowlegde about it.

2 can somebody that ownes one make a short video of the lines/ hullshape?

Many look at numbers lenght width height capacity rocker.
But those are almost as nothing saying as it is fast or stable.


3 groupbuy debate
If i was in the north eastern states or South eastern Canada i was in.

 

[tketcham]

If there was the best boat there should be more knowlegde about it.

I agree. I put the Clipper Prospector 14 up as a candidate for a solo canoe only as a suggestion. And I was careful to say it wasn't a whitewater playboat and would require a splash cover to keep dry. Also, additional floatation or dry bag floatation (or both) would be needed in case of a tip over or swamping.

I've been trying to find an account I read of someone that used the Clipper P14 for an expedition but cannot find it using web searches. I'll keep looking, but Google, et al have ruined web searches because the filters don't seem to work like they used to.

Regarding being part of a test group to purchase a used Clipper Prospector 14: I'd enjoy participating but I don't paddle whitewater (above Class 2) anymore and the debate seems to be mostly about its capabilities in Class 3 waters.

 

[tketcham]

Here's a post (in the thread link below) by Rubbaboo about the Clipper Prospector 14 being used as a whitewater play boat...

I’m comparing three boats: the Clipper Prospector 14, Clipper Caribou S, and the Nova Craft Prospector 15.

 

[ABT]

I put the Clipper Prospector 14 up as a candidate for a solo canoe only as a suggestion. And I was careful to say it wasn't a whitewater playboat and would require a splash cover to keep dry.

Here's a post (in the thread below) by Rubbaboo about the Clipper Prospector 14 being used as a whitewater play boat...

I hope my posts on the Clipper in the other thread have not been offensive or combative, I appreciated your post and think it’s as good a candidate for “best” as any. I have had an eye on it for some time now as a “possible great river boat”, I’ve just struggled to find good info on it, and run into conflicting reports on what it’s best at or why it’s spec’d the way it is. And so few firsthand accounts for whatever reason (I agree about the search engines and I think there’s probably info out there that’s just harder to find now).

Just for info, here is a different blog post about it, used on flatwater but noting it’s turning ability (again just seems to be much more than expected based on the spec - but that’s just the difficulty with trying to compare rocker specs)

14 Prospector, Packer, Solitude

Paddle Date: August 13, 2011 Paul and I met with fellow paddler Greg at Dougan Lake to compare 3 popular solo canoes sold by Abbotsford ba...

100lakesonvancouverisland.blogspot.com

They don’t seem to think it was unacceptable on a lake, and I’m just interested in what it can do in general. Is it ok as a playboat in class III? Is it best suited to class II? Class I, hauling a load?

If you only run class II at most, and if you are remotely interested in participating, I think your impressions would be just as important as someone that tries it on a lake and someone else that runs it in class III.

I would likely run it mostly on class I-II, and then if I think it has potential for it I’d try class III. Also, my class II-III is going to be different than out West, or up North in Canada, etc. so getting different impressions from different geography sounds very interesting to me. Seemed like a fun project if we could pull it off.

Clippers also seem less expensive than a lot of others, but the ones I have seen in person were excellent quality in my opinion. They just aren’t seen around here, and I’m interested to know if they’re overlooked simply due to location.

 

[tketcham]

I hope my posts on the Clipper in the other thread have not been offensive or combative, I appreciated your post and think it’s as good a candidate for “best” as any.

No worries.

They just aren’t seen around here, and I’m interested to know if they’re overlooked simply due to location.

The main reason I ended up with three Western Canoe/Clipper canoes over the years is that I lived in Washington state for some time and had friends with a Clipper Tripper 17' 6" that they really enjoyed. They let me (us) try it out a couple of times and I was impressed with how well it tracked and maneuvered. We were paddling a Wenonah Odyssey for comparison. Had I not been introduced to Clipper Canoes I'd probably never have considered them, even living in Washington. They get overshadowed by Wenonah, Bell/Northstar, and now Swift. I got to know the owners a bit and they were great people to deal with. Clipper is an underappreciated canoe builder in the USA, especially in the eastern part of the country.

 

[Steve in Idaho]

This quote from the Packer/Solitude/Prospector comparison linked by ABT could have been written by me about the Swift P14 after I paddled it - except maybe that "turns on a dime" part.

The Prospector is an agile and maneuverable solo which is a delight to play in. It responds instantly to even modest paddle strokes and in the kneeling position you can lean out on your paddle and spin the canoe beneath you. It is easy to scull sidways as well as on an angle backwards and forwards. This hull is well suited for investigating nooks and crannies along any shoreline because of it's responsiveness and "turn-on-a-dime" characteristics.

Although it turned well, I don't recall it being quite that turny. Photos of my test of the Swift don't show the bow stem out of the water like I see in that video. Watching the video in that blog, reminds me more of my MR Guide - but not quite.

As an aside, his comments in the first paragraph about the Solitude ring true to my experience. Those in the later paragraph about it throw some light on my confusion over what's been said in the past about the Wenonah Solitude. That's just to say the report in whole seems very credible to me.

 

[Steve in Idaho]

BTW - I'm not seeing the ad for that Clipper P14 in Montana anymore. Maybe because we're all talking about it?

 

[memaquay]

Clipper is one of the only companies still keeping their canoes in a reasonable price range. However, the reason they can do so is probably related to the weight. They don't see to be chasing the ultra light categories like swift, where sub 40 and 30 pound boats routinely run between 5 and 10 thousand dollars.

 

[eckilson]

My question is why would you call this boat a Prospector?

To me a Prospector is deep and wide with full stems and a fair amount of rocker that is designed to carry a load. It’s usually a tandem that is a bit of a barge on flatwater, but does OK with a little current. With the full stems it handles waves well, but with the deep sides it becomes a sail in the wind.

I was surprised to see that the Chestnut Canoe Company actually built some shorter boats that were considered "Prospector" models, but they were still quite wide for their length – 12’ x 32”, 14’ x 34 “, 15’ x 35”.

In their description of the Prospector 14, Swift says that the Prospector is "considered by many to be the best all-round canoe shape". I wouldn’t say that. Even Bill Mason paddled the narrower/less deep Pal in many of his videos. The Swift Prospector 14 is a little wider than the Clipper version, but neither is as wide at the 14’ Chestnut models.

So when I first looked at the recommendation for Clipper Prospector 14, it was the Prospector name that turned we off. When I looked at the spec’s there wasn’t much about the boat that looked like a Prospector to me. It is deep, but it is relatively narrow, not a lot of rocker, and relatively sharp entry at the bow. Shorter, but reminds me more of the Hemlock SRT.

If I ever got a chance to paddle it, I think I'd like the boat in spite of the name.

 

[tketcham]

So when I first looked at the recommendation for Clipper Prospector 14, it was the Prospector name that turned we off. When I looked at the spec’s there wasn’t much about the boat that looked like a Prospector to me.

When I was looking for a durable expedition tandem I didn't start out considering Clipper's Prospector 17, mainly because I considered any "Prospector" to be more about tradition than function. But taking a second look at Clipper's canoe, it doesn't really look like a Prospector, and it had the design characteristics I was after. Talking with Marlin Bayes, the owner, convinced me that it would be a great canoe for the trips I had planned. Ordered a Prospector 17 right then and there.

Like you said, Clipper's Prospectors don't look much like the traditional forms. If I still lived in Washington, I'd be back up to Abbotsford to check out the Prospector 14, just for the halibut.

 

[ABT]

BTW - I'm not seeing the ad for that Clipper P14 in Montana anymore. Maybe because we're all talking about it?

Facebook marketplace algorithms are weird and the search often doesn’t return things I know I’ve seen before, and then that same item will pop back up days later on its own as I’m scrolling, so I know it was there when I searched for it, it just didn’t show up for some reason. No clue why it’s like that.

I have this listing saved though so I can get back to it, seems to still be up for now:

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[ABT]

In their description of the Prospector 14, Swift says that the Prospector is "considered by many to be the best all-round canoe shape". I wouldn’t say that. Even Bill Mason paddled the narrower/less deep Pal in many of his videos.

Funny that Swift describes the prospector design that way since all of their prospectors are actually based off of other Chestnut designs. In this video Swift says their 15’ version is based off a Chestnut Bob Special, and the 16’ version is a combination of a Chestnut Cruiser and a Pal, and the 17’ is the same as the 16 just stretched out and widened an inch. And of course that 15’ tandem version is different than their new solo 15’ version, which is based off of their 14’ version, which is a Yost original and not based off any of the others. I think. Easy to see how the waters get muddied on what a Prospector actually “is”. Anymore I just figure a contemporary prospector *probably* has traditional looking stems. Beyond that, design and intended use case will be different maker to maker and even model to model, and impossible to tell without looking at specs and reading about that particular boat.

 

[Punkinhead]

That's why I appreciate that Northstar doesn't call any of their models a Prospector. They realize how muddy the definition has become.

 

[Steve in Idaho]

That's why I appreciate that Northstar doesn't call any of their models a Prospector. They realize how muddy the definition has become.

I think Northstar deliberately divorced from the label to make the point that they avoided the most negative aspect of the usual Prospector design - those sails at each end.

 

[Steve in Idaho]

My question is why would you call this boat a Prospector?

To me a Prospector is deep and wide with full stems and a fair amount of rocker that is designed to carry a load. It’s usually a tandem that is a bit of a barge on flatwater, but does OK with a little current. With the full stems it handles waves well, but with the deep sides it becomes a sail in the wind.

I was surprised to see that the Chestnut Canoe Company actually built some shorter boats that were considered "Prospector" models, but they were still quite wide for their length – 12’ x 32”, 14’ x 34 “, 15’ x 35”.

In their description of the Prospector 14, Swift says that the Prospector is "considered by many to be the best all-round canoe shape". I wouldn’t say that. Even Bill Mason paddled the narrower/less deep Pal in many of his videos. The Swift Prospector 14 is a little wider than the Clipper version, but neither is as wide at the 14’ Chestnut models.

So when I first looked at the recommendation for Clipper Prospector 14, it was the Prospector name that turned we off. When I looked at the spec’s there wasn’t much about the boat that looked like a Prospector to me. It is deep, but it is relatively narrow, not a lot of rocker, and relatively sharp entry at the bow. Shorter, but reminds me more of the Hemlock SRT.

If I ever got a chance to paddle it, I think I'd like the boat in spite of the name.

The Prospector name grabs our attention. But both the Clipper and the Swift 14 footers look to me more practical than what I would agree is truly a Prospector.

 

[eckilson]

Funny that Swift describes the prospector design that way since all of their prospectors are actually based off of other Chestnut designs.

Of the three, the 15 looks to me like a Prospector. The 16 and 17 are beautiful boats that I would love to have, but they look like typical cruising boats.

That's why I appreciate that Northstar doesn't call any of their models a Prospector. They realize how muddy the definition has become.

I love Northstar boats. If a could buy a new one it would be the Phoenix. You could easily slap the Prospector name on the B16 or B17, but I agree that it is good that they didn't.

 

[ABT]

Well, found an interesting video of the 14’ Clipper, and in my area no less. Too bad the company they use doesn’t sell boats anymore. Windy conditions, technically a river but more like flat water in reality. Skip to the 4 minute mark for actual paddling.

 

[ABT]

You could easily slap the Prospector name on the B16 or B17, but I agree that it is good that they didn't.

Yeah, I appreciate that their marketing is kind of tongue in cheek about it:

 

[Steve in Idaho]

Well, found an interesting video of the 14’ Clipper, and in my area no less. Too bad the company they use doesn’t sell boats anymore. Windy conditions, technically a river but more like flat water in reality. Skip to the 4 minute mark for actual paddling.

He should have been in the Solitude. Yep. Looked kinda like a Prospector in the wind.

 

[tketcham]

Yep. Looked kinda like a Prospector in the wind.

First thing I thought of when they set out was that Ken needed some extra weight in the canoe to help with tracking. Still, paddling in a heavy wind isn't much fun in a bouyant solo.