I normally order in the morning or early afternoon and it nearly always ships same day. Unless they're super busy I'm sure it will ship today. Hopefully you're in the same shipping zone as I am. My stuff shows up next day from them on Speedy.
Alan
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Happy International Museum Day!🏛️ 🖼️🏺
Nokomis Build
- Thread starter Jim Dodd
- Start date
I normally order in the morning or early afternoon and it nearly always ships same day. Unless they're super busy I'm sure it will ship today. Hopefully you're in the same shipping zone as I am. My stuff shows up next day from them on Speedy.
Alan
As a matter of fact, I called this am, and Mark said I should have it tomorrow, if Speedy is working ! That's fast, especially this time of year !
Oh, and I dropped your name ! Hoping that would get me a discount ! Ha !
Jim
Oh, and I dropped your name ! Hoping that would get me a discount ! Ha !
Jim
When Santa wasn't lookin, I slipped down to the shop, beings My Peel Ply showed up.
Laid out cloth, decided to go with 6 oz E-glass. Both the main layer, and the extra layer, over the football.
Made one mistake. When I ordered cloth, I had them ship it folded. DON'T DO THAT ! Always order it rolled. I know shipping is extra, but worth it. I hope it will be OK, as I'll be putting Peel Ply over it.
Tools all laid out.
Hoping Santa will fall asleep in the afternoon, after a tiring Night !
Here's some pics.
The stick with the marker, is used to mark where to trim the cloth for the football. I place a small dot, every foot or so, and trim dot to dot.
My tools lined up for wetting out.
Jim
Laid out cloth, decided to go with 6 oz E-glass. Both the main layer, and the extra layer, over the football.
Made one mistake. When I ordered cloth, I had them ship it folded. DON'T DO THAT ! Always order it rolled. I know shipping is extra, but worth it. I hope it will be OK, as I'll be putting Peel Ply over it.
Tools all laid out.
Hoping Santa will fall asleep in the afternoon, after a tiring Night !
Here's some pics.
The stick with the marker, is used to mark where to trim the cloth for the football. I place a small dot, every foot or so, and trim dot to dot.
My tools lined up for wetting out.
Jim
Where we buy our cloth, they roll it but don't have cores available, so we carefully brought it home then I bought a 6 foot piece of 1 1/2" ABS pipe and rerolled it onto that. It will have sufficient strength to not break or bend when I roll it out over the boat. I got 15 yards of cloth, which will give me two 30" wide pieces, one for the football on this boat and one for Christy's stripper that we built 4 years ago. Last trip out she holed it so we feel it prudent to add the extra layer at this point.
Next time we need cloth we will just take the core with us.
Next time we need cloth we will just take the core with us.
I don't see any elves in the workshop Jim. Looks like it's all up to you. Looking good.
Good point. I was thinking on using a dry roller, or maybe one of those bubble buster rollers I made last year. Would the squeegee have an advantage ?
Jim
I've done wet outs where I have only used a squeegee...the squeegee removes excess resin, gets rid of any bubbles, and helps smooth any wrinkles in the cloth.
Other than that, squeegees aren't much use!
BTW, that hull looks great! I bet it will zip right along.
Other than that, squeegees aren't much use!
BTW, that hull looks great! I bet it will zip right along.
OK, the outside of Nokomis is glassed.
It was a struggle, mostly because of the short pot life of the resin, I was using(RAKA 127 with 350 Non-blush hardener.), and the tumblehome in this build.
Wetting out the cloth went great, one of my better applications. I was hurried, and my Super Wife helped lay out the Peel Ply. I
couldn't have done it without her ! Love that woman !
I could not get a lot of the wrinkles out of the Peel Ply, mostly in the tumblehome area.
One thing about Peel Ply, is you can't see through it, and so what's going on underneath, is a mystery until you take it off. I had two spots where the cloth pulled away from the hull. That wouldn't have happened, had I skipped the Peel Ply.
I really doubt it saved me any resin, and I feel it was more trouble and expense, than it was worth, at least under these conditions.
As of now, I don't think I'll use Peel Ply over a full hull again.
I weighed the Peel Ply before laying it on the wet cloth. It weighed 1lb, 2 oz . After I pulled it off the hull, it weighed 1lb, 4oz. It really doesn't soak up much resin.
It did pull off good.
Here's a few pics.
This last pic is the hull with one fill coat after the Peel Ply. I put two more, one hour apart, that completely filled the weave.
The black rollers, on the floor, were used to press the Peel Ply into the resin. It worked, but I was unable to eliminate the wrinkles.
Jim
It was a struggle, mostly because of the short pot life of the resin, I was using(RAKA 127 with 350 Non-blush hardener.), and the tumblehome in this build.
Wetting out the cloth went great, one of my better applications. I was hurried, and my Super Wife helped lay out the Peel Ply. I
couldn't have done it without her ! Love that woman !
I could not get a lot of the wrinkles out of the Peel Ply, mostly in the tumblehome area.
One thing about Peel Ply, is you can't see through it, and so what's going on underneath, is a mystery until you take it off. I had two spots where the cloth pulled away from the hull. That wouldn't have happened, had I skipped the Peel Ply.
I really doubt it saved me any resin, and I feel it was more trouble and expense, than it was worth, at least under these conditions.
As of now, I don't think I'll use Peel Ply over a full hull again.
I weighed the Peel Ply before laying it on the wet cloth. It weighed 1lb, 2 oz . After I pulled it off the hull, it weighed 1lb, 4oz. It really doesn't soak up much resin.
It did pull off good.
Here's a few pics.
This last pic is the hull with one fill coat after the Peel Ply. I put two more, one hour apart, that completely filled the weave.
The black rollers, on the floor, were used to press the Peel Ply into the resin. It worked, but I was unable to eliminate the wrinkles.
Jim
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That's too bad you didn't have better luck with it. I can see where the tumblehome would have proved troublesome. I'll be trying peel ply on my composite Bloodvein and I hope I can learn from this. How was the finish in the areas were it did make good contact with the hull? If the entire hull had that finish do you think you could have gotten by with a little sanding and just one fill coat?
I don't usually rely on peel ply itself to remove a lot of resin but rather I find the benefit to be that it helps me to squeegee out excess resin and get a nice finish with fairly smooth seams at the same time. I see you said you used rollers to press the peel ply into the wet cloth. Did you try a squeegee too? I usually use a roller to be sure the peel ply is fully wetout and then a squeegee to remove air bubbles and excess resin. But even that wouldn't have gotten rid of your wrinkles without using multiple pieces or making slits in the cloth or both.
Alan
I don't usually rely on peel ply itself to remove a lot of resin but rather I find the benefit to be that it helps me to squeegee out excess resin and get a nice finish with fairly smooth seams at the same time. I see you said you used rollers to press the peel ply into the wet cloth. Did you try a squeegee too? I usually use a roller to be sure the peel ply is fully wetout and then a squeegee to remove air bubbles and excess resin. But even that wouldn't have gotten rid of your wrinkles without using multiple pieces or making slits in the cloth or both.
Alan
Hi Alan
For sure a slower curing resin would have helped.
After I finished rolling on the first coat, and I had started on the double layer area first, I could tell resin was getting just a little sticky. Ordinarily, that's fine ! I just go back over it with a dry roller, making sure everything is coated, and against the hull. This time I had to rush to get the Peel Ply on. Two people was a necessity. It would have worked better to have two people pulling at each end. But the resin was starting to get grabby. My wife was in good clothes, and I sent her home.
The Tumblehome problem might have been remedied with two people pulling the cloth from opposite ends, and a slower curing resin.
I guess I had expected the Peel Ply to take up more of the resin. It only absorbed 2 oz.
All in all, after the fill coats, it will be OK.
Would it be possible to get by with just one fill coat ? Possibly if there were no voids ! Two fill coats should be plenty.
I put extra fill coats, for three reasons. One, to fill the voids, two to give me a margin of error when sanding, but more important To be sure I could removed all wax, and release agent from Nokomis.
I'm not going to sand Nokomis until after I pull the carbon fiber hull off.
Tried a squeegee, but couldn't see a benefit. Again the fast cure rate to some degree.
Lessons learned !
I have more resin on the way, from RAKA UV- inhibited, with half the hardener slow, and the other half fast.
Jim
For sure a slower curing resin would have helped.
After I finished rolling on the first coat, and I had started on the double layer area first, I could tell resin was getting just a little sticky. Ordinarily, that's fine ! I just go back over it with a dry roller, making sure everything is coated, and against the hull. This time I had to rush to get the Peel Ply on. Two people was a necessity. It would have worked better to have two people pulling at each end. But the resin was starting to get grabby. My wife was in good clothes, and I sent her home.
The Tumblehome problem might have been remedied with two people pulling the cloth from opposite ends, and a slower curing resin.
I guess I had expected the Peel Ply to take up more of the resin. It only absorbed 2 oz.
All in all, after the fill coats, it will be OK.
Would it be possible to get by with just one fill coat ? Possibly if there were no voids ! Two fill coats should be plenty.
I put extra fill coats, for three reasons. One, to fill the voids, two to give me a margin of error when sanding, but more important To be sure I could removed all wax, and release agent from Nokomis.
I'm not going to sand Nokomis until after I pull the carbon fiber hull off.
Tried a squeegee, but couldn't see a benefit. Again the fast cure rate to some degree.
Lessons learned !
I have more resin on the way, from RAKA UV- inhibited, with half the hardener slow, and the other half fast.
Jim
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In defense of Peel Ply, it did smooth the overlapping layers. very little feathering will be required.
The voids filled in nicely.
In prepping for the Carbon Fiber Nokomis CFN, I'm planning on just release coating, no waxing prior to the Partal coatings. I can see waxing a female mold, where I would be using it again, but beings It's a one time use, I don't see the need.
Thoughts ?
Jim
The voids filled in nicely.
In prepping for the Carbon Fiber Nokomis CFN, I'm planning on just release coating, no waxing prior to the Partal coatings. I can see waxing a female mold, where I would be using it again, but beings It's a one time use, I don't see the need.
Thoughts ?
Jim
I'd spend some time searching the boatdesign.net forums on mold preparation. Lots of great advice and some scary stories.
I'm not saying it won't work and there are even one or two guys that say they never wax and instead use one very light layer of sprayed PVA. After seeing the nice coverage I got spraying PVA on my mold I don't doubt it could work. But I've never got coverage like that trying to brush or wipe it on. I still plan to use wax and PVA for my next one. I'll try using only PVA on smaller parts where failure wouldn't be so painful before trying it on a large project.
During my research it sounded like Johnsons paste wax was one of the better waxes. Many liked it better than the waxes specifically designed for mold release.
Alan
Hi Alan
I'll scope out boatdesign.net. Thanks I need another forum ! HA Never too many boat building forums !!!
I just placed an order with Express Composites for a gallon of Partall, and some 4 oz E-glass. If I decide to go the wax route, the Johnson's is available locally.
I really don't want wax, on Nokomis or CFN. I have fears, maybe unfounded, of the wax contaminating any bonding surfaces. I'm even worried about the Partall, but I'm going with it, due to the troubles I've had with the window film, used in the past.
Now for a sprayer.
Jim
I'll scope out boatdesign.net. Thanks I need another forum ! HA Never too many boat building forums !!!
I just placed an order with Express Composites for a gallon of Partall, and some 4 oz E-glass. If I decide to go the wax route, the Johnson's is available locally.
I really don't want wax, on Nokomis or CFN. I have fears, maybe unfounded, of the wax contaminating any bonding surfaces. I'm even worried about the Partall, but I'm going with it, due to the troubles I've had with the window film, used in the past.
Now for a sprayer.
Jim
It goes on thin and seems to last forever. Judging by how much I used on my first composite canoe mold the pint I bought will last me a couple years. I still have over half of a quart bottle I bought years ago but I was starting to worry about age. Just wanted to mention it in case it's not too late to change your order.
If you don't come up with something, and if schedules work out, I could bring my spray gun on a field trip.
Alan
A gallon. I'm planning on using it up this Summer ! HA ! Besides, I tend to spill a lot !
That would be AWESOME ! Are you using a HVLP sprayer ?
I'm working at the school three days next week. Mon, Thurs and Friday.
But just about anything else would work ! Assuming the weather cooperates ! It's looking pretty thick out right now !
Jim
That would be AWESOME ! Are you using a HVLP sprayer ?
I'm working at the school three days next week. Mon, Thurs and Friday.
But just about anything else would work ! Assuming the weather cooperates ! It's looking pretty thick out right now !
Jim
My Wife's house is really cutting into my canoe building !
I managed to get about two hours of sanding time on Nokomis today.
The troubles with the Peel Ply That I had were worth it !
It really pushes the cloth down on the hull, and feathers the seams of the bias cloth, and extra layer. I WILL try it again ! Just I'll be using a different resin. Something with a longer pot life.
No pics today, and It sounds like the weather will keep me indoors tomorrow. Good time to do the cupboard work I promised my Bride !
Jim
I managed to get about two hours of sanding time on Nokomis today.
The troubles with the Peel Ply That I had were worth it !
It really pushes the cloth down on the hull, and feathers the seams of the bias cloth, and extra layer. I WILL try it again ! Just I'll be using a different resin. Something with a longer pot life.
No pics today, and It sounds like the weather will keep me indoors tomorrow. Good time to do the cupboard work I promised my Bride !
Jim
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