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Swift Keewaydin 14

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I'm starting to look at solo boats. I do a lot of solo tripping but until now it's been in tandem canoes. I'd love to drop some weight from the portages. Anyone used the Swift solo boats? I've got a Swift Winisk and I've been happy with it, wondering if the solo options from Swift are also decent. I'm a mid sized guy (165-170lbs) and i travel light, so I'm not too worried about carriage capacity. I just don't want something that's super tippy. I'm also open to other makes/models/personal favourites.

Thanks!
 
Drew, Swift has some interesting offerings. I've been very happy in my Osprey. I use it for flat water paddling when my route involves long arduous portages. I, too, paddled tandems solo for many years, and still do, but dedicated solos have some real advantages. For a dedicated solo, the Osprey isn't a speed demon, but neither is it slow. A major advantage over tandems paddled solo is the solo's performance in headwinds. I find the optional sliding moveable seat to be hugely advantageous for adjusting trim in variable wind conditions, though not all will agree with me on that. On this year's ice-out Nipissing R. Trip I had the good fortune to meet and chat with Joe Robinet, a "bushcrafter" with a very successful blog and Youtube career. He was very happy double-blading a 13.5 ft Swift Pack canoe. The Swift Pack canoes and Keewaydins come with some interesting layups and seating options. People often paddle these models with double blades, and some with bent-shafts, but that's another discussion. What I like most about my Osprey is its versatility, its light weight, and the fact that it's not more "boat" than I usually require for 1-2 week trips. It's fine for fishing out of, too. The "Keewaydins" have been attracting some feverish attention of late. I haven't paddled one, so don't know how warranted that attention is. Enjoy looking, and hopefully, you'll get to test paddle some interesting hulls. One caveat: don't expect to love a first paddle in a new hull. If you do love it immediately, it can simply be because it behaves similarly to boats you're already comfortable paddling.
 
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The Keewaydins are a little more user friendly than the Osprey. DY designed some things in to make it more friendly to the new to soloing paddler. That said the 14 is going to be a little slower but more maneuverable than the 15. I know Turtle has the 14 and is the same size as you.
 
Mr. Lakes, I enjoyed your vid even though it turned out to be a torture trip (the trip not the vid)... Swift has had demo days for their various canoes spring and early summer at various locations for test-paddling. You might want to contact them to find out whether they'll be be bringing both an Osprey and Kee in the size you want.

I really wish Joe Robinet would stop using that windmilling double blade but maybe there's no other option in a pack canoe... it's so much more pleasing to watch a traditional canoe paddle being used. I don't know how he can keep that up for hours and hours... I'd be brain-dead in no time.

PS... IIRC Algonquin Outfitters and the Swift stores will let you test-paddle any time.

And another PS... some have preferred Hemlock canoes after trying the Swifts. Somewhere east of Buffalo NY with variously-sized Peregrine, Kestrel, SRT... ? Never been there, never tried 'em. Also Oak Orchard near Rochester NY, for Wenonahs and whatever else. The high US greenback might make Swift the easier choice.
 
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that windmilling double blade but maybe there's no other option in a pack canoe.

Depending on the design, of course you can single blade. Hornbecks have constant flare in their older models which dooms you to the double but in the RapidFire I love using a little 46 inch bent shaft single

Lots of people never develop single stick skills and paddle any canoe with a double blade.

My favorite tripper is a Swift Heron.. a performance solo from 1993. It must have dumped many test paddlers at the dock cause after the mold broke Swift did not resurrect it. Never seen quite as fast a solo but it was from the days that you were expected to have single stick skills and there were many performance solo canoes.

Hemlock Canoes of course is in Hemlock NY just south of Rochester. Other paddle and canoe makers in the area that have solo canoes are Colden and Dogpaddle. The Swifts are a Rochester area family as well as Dave Yost. the designer. and the folks that make Fox Worx paddles.
 
If I were shopping for a solo, I definitely would look at the Swift keeywadin 14 ..... but also look at the 13'6" Adir pack boat. We took the pack boat in one trip and it is fast, stable and a lot of fun and at 24 pounds, it is almost a shoulder carry.

The Keewaydin 14 is also a very fine craft, which we ahave also tripped with ... I think both would be suitable for your purpose.

I would definitely find out how you can get in each for a test paddle, different boats and you would be wise to see which one you like best ... or maybe you just won't like them.

We tend to move at a good clip and the Osprey and Shearwater models have never really been at the top of our "I want" list ...


Brian
 
yes, I had a Kee 14 with a high seat and it worked well. I think you really need to decide weather you want a high or on the floor seat first as that really separates most choices-yes you can get a Kee both ways. I much prefer a high seat my self.
Turtle
 
And another PS... some have preferred Hemlock canoes after trying the Swifts. Somewhere east of Buffalo NY with variously-sized Peregrine, Kestrel, SRT... ?

Similar to you I'm coming from paddling a tandem sole, in my case a 2001 Swift Algonquin 16 . Never owned any other solo by design either until I picked up a 2012 Peregrine a few weeks ago. So take my honeymoon "solo" opinion in stride...

Before the Peregrine came available my short list was Nomad, Osprey, Peregrine, Keewadyin 15 and a Shearwater, not necessarily in that order. Where I live test paddling any of the above in short order requires $500 airfare and rental cars though, so I had to gamble on reviews and opinions of others. In my mind I was all but all in on a Shearwater until the Peregrine popped up in the classifieds and after some quick math decided a used model might be a good idea for my first solo. :)

After 3 trips, a 10 mile, 19 mile and 14 mile sprint last weekend, the Peregrine has far exceeded my expectations. Workmanship and lamination is superb. Was sipping coffee a little after sunrise this morning just staring at it, beautiful lines.

Can't give you Charlie Wilson's wisdom on all matters canoeing and he rates the L/W ratio of the Kee 14 at 6.5, Key 15 at 6.8 and Peregrine at 6.8.

I can give you some rough "on the water" numbers to work with in my case. The first trip it was loaded with at least 75-100lbs of gear (35qt Yeti loaded, 50-60lbs of hickory firewood, 3 gallons of water, food and camping gear), plus my 200lbs of living in excess. The Peregrine performed really well in my opinion. I was able to maintain 3.6 - 3.7 mph cruise via GPS without what I would consider a lot of effort, seems to glide with ease loaded or not.

My last 14 mile trip was a lightly loaded (cooler, ice, water, rain gear and 3 cliff bars, est 25-30lbs) workout paddle in 95 degree weather. My GPS track on that sprint shows a few short 5.7 - 5.9mph segments and a couple bursts at 6.2-3 mph with a round trip average speed of 4.4 mph or 14 miles in 3:10. This was a slow moving river trip, probably about 1-1.5mph current, 7 miles against and 7 mile return with the current. Can't say quantitatively whether I was over or under powering the canoe based on it's geometry, but I can say I wasn't particularly tired after that 14 mile jaunt. I felt it the next day or two, but it wasn't like I was thinking I'll never do that again. It was more a matter of my own conditioning and learning to use my core more for power and rotation than my arms and shoulders

I don't have any requirement for deft maneuvering nor do I have the skill either, but I find the Peregrine easy to handle and control loaded or not for my cruising purposes, much easier than the Algonquin paddled backwards for sure. I also found the Peregrine to be very stable, even sitting with the seat in the kneeling configuration. I could stand up and fly cast from it too for short periods of time. I wouldn't say its comfortable in this regard in that you have to really pay attention and work to stay centered. In the Algonquin I'm not even thinking about balance when standing, so they are as one would expect very different in that regard.

I think stability has a lot to do with one's sense of balance as much or more than the characteristics of the design, but if stability is important to you in a solo I would rate the Peregrine as pretty darn stable. I've heard the Keewaydin's are very stable too. As Charlie often says new solo designs are bulging at the mid section as most contemporary paddlers are, myself included. I've had the Peregrine laid over on a rail for short periods while sitting with the seat in the sitting position and it likes it there too. The first time I thought I would go over, but it resisted more than I expected. I suspect the Kee 14/15 and others too have better secondary stability than most paddlers.

Paddling healed like that is a new experience for me and at least for now the Peregrine seems a lot better at it than I am. Kneeling would be easier too, but I haven't tried that yet since it's not something I feel a need to do for my type of canoeing.

Bottom line, the Keewaydin your considering and all of the others in the same category are probably excellent in their own right and may have salient characteristics among them that are more important to you, but if you can manage to test any of Dave's models I think the time and effort would be well worth it.

Link to a 1.5 minute video my buddy put together from one of our trips with some footage of the Peregrine with my fat arse in it...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUslyFOHknw
 
I can't help you with anything about the Kee - but I think this is worth repeating...

One caveat: don't expect to love a first paddle in a new hull. If you do love it immediately, it can simply be because it behaves similarly to boats you're already comfortable paddling.

When I first got my Dagger Sojourn (my first solo canoe), which has some reputation of being quite"tippy" at rest and hard to turn, I was pretty sure I would probably replace it at the first opportunity at another used solo canoe with "better manners". I stuck with it because solo canoes are rare here, and used solo canoes are rarer still. After some time with it, I got pretty comfortable. Now I doubt if I'll ever let it go. With time in the seat, the "flat water solo" gets more versatile than its reputation might suggest.
 
It is possible to hate a hull with more time paddling it.. I tend to heel boats over and the Argosy hates that or hates me. Out it goes next week. For $800 including all the airbags we own ( two solo two end and one center for a tandem). Not river paddling on whitewater any more.

Its enroute to New Castle PA for the Rendezvous but if anyone would like me to leave it on the side of the road for cash that is fine.
 
Lots of great information here. Thank you to everyone who replied. I'll definitely be looking at some of the other models mentioned as well.
 
If you have a chance try the Keewaydin 14 Pack boat. I have one in the 15' length and it is a great solo canoe. Very stable as you sit low and can handle the bigger weather.
 
I paddle the Kee 15 and really like it. It's a fast canoe, has great secondary stability, and holds more gear then you should take.
 
I think all the feedback you've gotten is spot on. Will you kneel or sit? I love my Osprey and if you kneel and also paddle on rivers it may be closest to your Winisk in character, but I also agree that the Kees are more user friendly. The Kee 15 and Peregrine are somewhat similar (effortless cruising and stable and comfy)...I have never paddled a Kee 14. The Hemlock Kestrel would also fit your needs well given your relatively light load; it's a little hot rod but also stable and friendly.
 
I have owned both the osprey and kee 14(kneeling). Very different boats. The kee is noticeably smaller with a narrower paddling station which I liked. The kee turns well if you heal it a little bit. The osprey is wider, more seaworthy and better in moving water, although sensitive to quartering winds astern,and turns well flat if you have weight foreword-hence the sliding seat. Surprisingly, the osprey is close to equally fast for the same effort. Capacity is similar, the osprey doesn't like to be loaded heavy-the kee just shrugs. I imagine sweepers weight hauling info for the 15 is right on.
Turtle
 
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