Bringing an old FLY or Tarp back to life

[southcove]

Reading through some recent posts on giving life back to favorite tents, tarps, etc. And in particular Mike McCrea's recent thread on seam sealing and such ("Refurbishing a Favorite old tent")...got me to thinking that I have had more issue recently with some tents that the fly and/or separate tarps) has stopped beading up rain and snow properly.

What have people been using - finding the results good, bad or indifferent - wash ins, sprays or other techniques to bring the durable water proofing effect back to the exterior surface of their tents or tarps? Nothing more disturbing to be out in the woods and to find your tent fly or tarp wetting out and not shedding the rain drops like you want to see them do.

Products I have used; have given decent results but haven't lasted, been expensive or been unsatisfying all around. Whatever is used initially at the factory seems to last the best until it doesn't...anything applied afterwards always seems more like a bandaid approach.


(on a related side note) I have some older and not so older rain apparel both the G-T brand, other so called water proof breathables or just plain coated and the exterior DWR on those typically also seems to have a very finite and sometimes quite short shelf life.

 

[Guest]

What have people been using - finding the results good, bad or indifferent - wash ins, sprays or other techniques to bring the durable water proofing effect back to the exterior surface of their tents or tarps?

Products I have used; have given decent results but haven't lasted, been expensive or been unsatisfying all around. Whatever is used initially at the factory seems to last the best until it doesn't...anything applied afterwards always seems more like a bandaid approach.

I will be curious about any product that works long lastingly well. For tarps and tent rainflies maybe:

You can make your own sealant for silnylon. Get a caulking tube (or 2 or 3) of good quality 100% silicone. Cut it with mineral spirits (I have also used lacquer thinner) until it is the consistence that you want or need for penetration.

I have used this mixture to completely re-coat a rain fly for a 45 year old backpacking tent, that the coating completely flaked off of. Put it in the washing machine for several cycles, that stripped the remainder of the flaking coating off. No idea what was originally used as waterproofing. Set the tent up, with the fly in its normal configuration. Used the silicone thinly mixed to paint it, and let it dry in place. Has sealed it and it has worked great now for several years.

(on a related side note) I have some older and not so older rain apparel both the G-T brand, other so called water proof breathables or just plain coated and the exterior DWR on those typically also seems to have a very finite and sometimes quite short shelf life.

I have tried a variety of waterproofing stuff over the years on Gore-tex and other breathable fabrics, including Nikwax and ScotchGuard. IIRC the latter is not what it once was for some Causes Cancer in California type reason.

They worked OK, to varying degrees. None last very long and I wondered how much breathability I was sacrificing.

I did not expect great results; my experience with breathable raingear is that the fabric itself, even on the pricier stuff, simply wears thin with rubbing and chaffing over time and use. The worst wear area is always to top of the shoulders on a rain jacket; some were dang near translucent and no DWR treatment was going to help much.

I was once on a search for a quality rain jacket that had double fabric on that shoulder wear area. And found some made with just that feature. But $350 for a rain jacket was too rich for my blood.

 

[southcove]

I am hoping someone has a better solution, store bought or homemade like the silicone and mineral spirits seems to be for seam sealing. I have a few that the DWR is really gone on the surface (which is what cause it to bead so readily when new) and at least one Sierra Designs tent fly that has gone all bonkers on the underside of the nylon or polyester where the actual coating is applied at the fabric treating process stage.

The cut down silicone certainly is one option for a total fly recoat.

One of my brothers spend his life outdoors in Alaska and he says he has tried every commercial product available and that none of them are worth a darn once the factory coating or DWR has worn off. To me, any so called waterproof-breathable is already suspect on either part of that promise, my take is that in most circumstances a W-B outer surface on a raincoat, pants, hat, or sleeping bag is a hornets nest of compromises and my closet has a few G-T products of various vintages and levels of usage that just wet out on the surface no matter spray or wash in recoating product.

 

[Guest]

I am hoping someone has a better solution, store bought or homemade like the silicone and mineral spirits seems to be for seam sealing. I have a few that the DWR is really gone on the surface (which is what cause it to bead so readily when new) and at least one Sierra Designs tent fly that has gone all bonkers on the underside of the nylon or polyester where the actual coating is applied at the fabric treating process stage.

The cut down silicone certainly is one option for a total fly recoat.

I am hoping Boatstall, who successfully recoated just such tent fly with a thin DIY mixture, will chime in.

If no better solution presents itself play with sealing the tent floor seams first to get a feel for the DIY mix consistency and application and then, I dunno, maybe use a short foam roller to spread a DIY layer on the fly.

FWIW I have now seam sealed a half dozen tents and tarps and still have silicone left, so a tube of 100% silicone and some mineral spirits would certainly be the least expensive solution.

One of my brothers spend his life outdoors in Alaska and he says he has tried every commercial product available and that none of them are worth a darn once the factory coating or DWR has worn off. To me, any so called waterproof-breathable is already suspect on either part of that promise, my take is that in most circumstances a W-B outer surface on a raincoat, pants, hat, or sleeping bag is a hornets nest of compromises and my closet has a few G-T products of various vintages and levels of usage that just wet out on the surface no matter spray or wash in recoating product.

Yeah, I accept that longevity failure. Except in hats; I have never treated our Seattle Sombreros or Kokatats and they are as dry as the day we bought them.

But I live in Gore-Tex or etc cloned outwear on off-season trips, as a wind layer even when it is not raining. While the breathability is questionably when I get to sweaty exertions it is still the best packable compromise solution I have found.

I also accept that I am going to wear out a rain jacket every few years, +/- depending on the quality. And wear out a pair of rain pants, even with duct tape field patches on the knees, somewhat less frequently.

The $350 breathable rain jacket with double fabric shoulder epaulets will never be in my budget. Nor will the matching $300 rain pants with double fabric knees.

 

[boatstall]

Hey southcove, as McCrea quoted, I have indeed recoated a fly. Have a small one-man "backpacking tent". I really liked it, but the coating on the fly started flaking off. It is at least 45 years old, so finding a replacement fly would not be possible. I like carrying it as a back-up plan for the rare times that I don't have suitable trees for my hammock. It is a really small package, easy to pack, and dirt simple to set. As a last resort, I tried to strip off as much as possible of the flaking factory coating. Ran in washing machine until it got off as much as possible.

I set up the tent in the back yard, and set the fly as taught as was possible. Cut the silicone down to a really thin solution. It has been a while, so I can't really remember what size brush I used, but it was most likely a 2 or 3 inch foam brush. I just painted the fly with the silicone mixture while it was set onto the tent. I didn't have anything to lose, and no other option.

I remember doing at least two coats. I just left it set up, and it finally cured out. Rained several times on it, while it was set up. Worked as it should have.

Admittedly, it does not fit as easily back into its stuff sack. Seems a tad stiffer, but I didn't care, because it enabled the tent to be functional again. Didn't weigh it to see before and after weight, but it had to have gained several ounces, from however much silicone I had applied. But it has at least had its life extended, and my canoes don't care if it has gained a bit of weight. If that was the case, I would not be allowed onboard.

Sure wish there was a good solution for refurbishing the "breathable" fabrics.

 

[southcove]

Thanks for weighing in, again.

Did you do the topside or underside of the fly...I have wondered a bit about that since the rain hits the topside of any tarp or fly material but then hits the impermeable barrier of the coating and runs off or rolls off (if the DWR is still hanging about)...the underside less exposed to rubbing, UV, etc.

My SD tent is the same, the factory coating just turned to flakes one winter while gently rolled in a cotton bag next to two other SD stablemates of similar vintages, so that is first step (the factory deemed it not worthy of being covered by their now less than generous coverage and in any case, it going to an outside service vendor) to being able to use the tent under normal conditions again.

My backpacking days are probably now over, so as long as it rolled up nearly as close as the original it's okay.

Perhaps someone will weigh in still on the WP-Breathable garment treatments. I sure haven't been impressed at all by wash-ins or spray ons.

 

[boatstall]

You are welcome southcove. I will check on that fly this weekend, when I get back in. Think only the topside, but it has been a few years, and I have slept since then.