Share your opinion on a new canoe?

[Alasgun]

Ok, since it’s you guy’s fault im even considering another boat i thought your combined expertise may he helpful if i go down this path.
All the information i’ve been exposed to on this site has stirred desire for a little higher grade boat than the Discovery. The bigest problem is shipping. I have no problem shelling out $3700 for a Northstar B16 but the shipping and concern for shipping problems would add appreciably to the project.
Then right out of the blue, i stumbled onto these folks who are within 30 miles of me; offering what looks like decent, higher end boats, and i can “buy local”. They do not look as “well finished” as a Northstar but if the strength is there and the weight manageable; id be fine with that!
I'm interested in some variant of the Prospector and will call tomorrow to discuss the options shown; then i’ll drive over and heft one to feel the difference. At 72, I cant jerk the Discovery over my head and wonder how different hefting 47 rather than 77 feels?
If you’re inclined, peruse they’re site and tell me what you’d choose and why.
Thanks, Mike

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alaskacanoecompany.com

 

[Tryin']

I would personally stay away from foam core, but that's because I run rivers and don't miss many rocks. The parallel to your B16 will be their Prospector. I would go pay them a visit and see if you like it.

You mention that they do not look as "finished" as a northstar, but my experience has been that northstar has plenty of cosmetic bloopers in the form of misaligned fabrics, resin creases, etc. Not a diss, just noting that there may not be any difference in finishing work.

Again, canoe builder less than an hour from me? You bet I'm checking them out.

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

If I were over 60 and likely buying my last canoe, and if I were willing to shell out close to $4,000, and if I wanted something with some reasonable stability and space, but not so long as to be a beast to paddle solo, and finally if I were willing not to paddle it down rocky rivers and to treat it gently, I'd go for a canoe in the 15.5' to 17' range in the lightest weight layup available, hopefully getting one under 40 pounds.

The lighter a canoe is, the more likely it'll be used, and it'll get heavier each year after 60.

Ergo: If all those assumptions are close to your situation, I'd recommend that company's 16-9 Prospector in the lightest weight layup they offer. All the other canoes are too short or too long.

If you are only going to paddle solo, have them install only one wide seat about 15"-18" behind the central portage thwart, so the canoe will trim as equally as possible, and don't bother with the usual bow and stern seats. Eliminating them will lighten the weight even more. If the canoe is under 40 pounds and most of your portaging is just back and forth to your vehicle, you could even forget a central portage thwart and have solo seat about 6" behind center for perfect trim. A canoe that light is easy to carry for short distances and put on/off a car without a portage thwart.

Make sure you try paddling the canoes as well as lifting them.

 

[stripperguy]

Mike,
I’ve seen the projects you’ve done, and I have hints of your background and skills.
You can easily build your own canoe, of any design you wish, for a fraction of the costs of any quality production boat.
Whether woodstrpped or full composite, I’m sure you would enjoy the journey as much as the end result.
There are many of us experienced builders that would gladly be virtual mentors, if that’s what you might want.
Think about it, and it’s not just a financial decision, as you know there’s great satisfaction in building and using your own equipment and toys.

 

[ppine]

In 45 years, I have owned one new canoe. When I lived in Wyoming I ordered a Wenonah from Minnesota. It took a long time to get there and shipping cost a lot. When the boat arrived, the hull was wavy as heck and no bueno. I sent it back.

Buying used canoes is much more rewarding. Go look, buy it or not and bring it home. I always make money on used canoes.

 

[billconner]

All 3 of mine are used. Work just fine.

 

[Alasgun]

Thanks for the feed back guys. As to buying used; id be all for it cept this truly is a last frontier and my options are coleman scanoes, old town’s or something aluminum. Very seldom does a nice canoe come up for sale around here. I did see a nice swift once except it was not anywhere close to light. Over 60 lbs!

As to building one; that wont happen due to a lack of available time. I raise Rabbits and grow a large Garden each year and in 30 more days that season will be upon me. Then i practically run until October when is slows again. At 72, i’ve decided the projects need to be smaller and id rather throw money at something and go use it now.

I visited with Ben (alaska canoe) this morning and liked what i heard. He’s been in the business roughly 5 years and has 5 dozen boats under his belt. He said about a month per boat, and it sounds like i could have one by spring; so id be good with that.
when i visit the shop later this week i can look at a variety of boats and get a better feel for all this. He has another client wanting a 37 lb or under boat and our conversation got interesting when i learned that. Based on the feel i get while visiting in person i’m going to try and turn this into a win, win for all 3 of us!
More after some show and tell!

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

Mike, ask what his lamination technology is: hand layup, vacuum bagging, or resin infusion. Those are listed in chronological order of their invention, and generally in their ability to produce the lightest weight by eliminating the most useless resin from the laminate. There are exceptions: for example, a very experienced hand laminator probably can come close to the other two technologies.

Swift uses resin infusion. Northstar and Wenonah use vacuum bagging. Hemlock is hand lamination by probably the most experienced guy doing it for canoes, Dave Curtis. Actually, it doesn't matter in a practical sense for Alaska Canoe—they laminate however they laminate, and you either like what you see or you don't.

They show a lot of interesting accessories and options in their extensive photo gallery, including a central seat/portage yoke combo.

I raise Rabbits

Just curious. For what purpose do you raise rabbits and how many at any given time?

 

[Alasgun]

Ben hand lay’s canoe hulls and bags paddles & accessories and is aware of, and interested in the infusion process. He mentioned “each hull i do gets lighter” so he’s learning little bits along the way as he improves the process.
i’m scheduled to go over in the morning before 10;00!

I keep a buck and 3 does (pure bred Satin’s and a Californian) and am probably the only guy in the state who raises them for the poop! All the feed is organic; coming out of California and my system allows me to capture all the byproducts which go thru the compost pile before being applied on the garden and greenhouse beds. Along the way i have all the Rabbit i want to eat and plenty of stock to choose from when someone needs a few breeders. Like most things i get involved with, this project is way over the top when it comes to Accommodation's in the rabbit barn; which sports amenities such as murals painted on the walls and ceiling, timed lights and classical music, water that flows 24/7, electric heat and an outside fenced court yard they can access when it’s warm enough to pull out the wall plugs! it’s more than adequate would be an under statement!

 

[Alasgun]

My trip to the “canoe factory‘ was great, i talked some and listened some and enjoyed everything i saw. We settled on a layup and trim package and i put up the “down”. Many details will be decided as we go along but having someone you can talk to about every aspect of your boat is priceless. I forwarded my builder some information later this afternoon and he responded telling me he’d start the build on February 6th. My Birthday.

Once something tangible hatches; i’ll keep you in the loop.

 

[MrPoling]

That Discovery is heavy, short, and a little floppy, so just about anything composite is going to feel light and fast.

However I do have one concern for you. I'm not sure composite boat, especially a light one, is a good replacement for the Dipship. If I was going to drag a canoe full of fish up a hill on a cart I think I'd rather have a Royelex or T-Formex canoe. And the Disco isn't a bad choice if that is what's available.

I glanced back at the Dipship post and didn't see pictures of the cart. The commercially available carts I've seen don't offer enough support to carry a composite canoe with extra weight in it.

If you didn't mention carting the fish up the hill to the builder it might be conversation worth having.

 

[Alasgun]

We did discuss this and with a boat this light i can off load the fish bags and walk up the hill, to the truck, carrying the canoe then come back for the fish bags. Another cool aspect of all this is; the Builder fishes the same fishery so we were able to talk directly about this rock or that downed tree!!
BUT now that im a member of the “more than one boat” club; the dip ship will certainly get trialed And possibly become my “work boat”!

 

[Glenn MacGrady]

Well, give us a clue as to the model at least. Is it the Prospector or what?

 

[Alasgun]

Sorry; yes it’s the prospector. It’s still pretty early but the plan is Alder trim outside, carbon inside; inwales, seats and thwart. For color i really like Hemlock’s new “Sage”. It will be built as a solo with seat shelves installed for a bow seat that will remain out 95%of the time.

 

[memaquay]

Sounds like a lot of fun.....my only concern is the design specs on the prospector. 34 inches seems a bit narrow to me for a generic prospector design. Does he have design specs listed somewhere, for instance, rocker, center depth, stuff like that? Hard to tell from the pictures, but the prospector looks like a modern tripping type hull, I'm thinking souris river Quetico or something along those lines.

 

[lowangle al]

Good luck with it Mike. It seems like a good choice and they seem like a good company.

I liked some of the stuff in their photo gallery. It looked like he attaches thwarts to wood gunnels with oak dowels. The reversible sliding seat was also pretty cool.

 

[Alasgun]

Yesterday i measured the mould at 35 & 14 and didn’t discuss rocker, i will at some point.

I appreciate an “attention to detail” and am fond of the oak dowels myself! For a more skilled individual a sliding carbon seat may be appealing, i’m not fond of the tractor type seats from a comfort standpoint. If i cant scoot around or twist a good bit; in short order im sore!

Today being “the day after” i awoke with a head full of excitement and a ton of things yet to be discussed, which is different yet welcome.
After all those years in industry fixing other people’s broke stuff (high end pump, turbine and engine) it’s nice to find myself as the financier rather than the laborer! That must be an ole guy perk?

 

[Alasgun]

Ok, we’re off and running now. My boat is scheduled to be layed up on the 18th. In the mean time i’ll machine some of the components and have them ready. Today i started on the seat mount pads and got 8ea roughed to shape. More layers will come off until i like the weight, right now they’re a wee bit heavy.
These pictures just show some of the process.
All surfaces that will “get glued” have a fly-cut finish And before they go in these surfaces will also get an aggressive bead blast.

 

[Alasgun]

The gel coat is in the mould and my builder will do the layup today.
I brought the raw seat frames home yesterday after offering to do the machine work. I’ll fly cut the top and bottom surfaces and make the lacing hole penetrations on the Bridgeport, where a digital readout helps do nearly perfect layout!
There’s a lot to be said for having a canoe builder in town! I’m really enjoying having the ability to participate in the build beyond the initial decision's.
i’ve chosen Sage gel coat, Alder gunnels/seats and carbon thwarts/grabs. As progress happens i’ll put some pictures up.

 

[Alasgun]

Here’s the mostly finished bow seat frame, i’ll complete the stern frame tomorrow.