Maximum Wind Speed

[Bothwell Voyageur]

Ignoring the effects of wave action, what is the maximum wind speed a couple of average Joe paddlers in a regular prospector style canoe can still make headway? I ask because I have experienced a few occasions when the wind has been really blowing but due to topography there water has been flat and we have been pretty much blown to a standstill. The weather report afterwards gave speeds of around 45-50kph, any more and I think we would have been going backwards.

On one trip in the UK Lake District I was paddling solo and the wind gusts were strong enough to suddenly stop me and force me backwards. All I could do was put the blade in the water and steer to stop myself turning sideways.

Anyone got any empirical numbers?

 

[Qayaq]

My wife and I just got back from a trip on the Waterfound River in Northern Saskatchewan with a 17 foot Pakboat. We rounded a bend in the river and went down a small set of rapids but the bend put us face on into a stiff wind coming out of a small lake through the narrowing of the river. I have no way of knowing the actual wind speed but I'm guessing it was 50 kph minimum. The waves from the wind were colliding with the waves from the rapids to produce some haystacks that we had to power through to make headway. We actually stopped paddling for a bit and were sitting still in the rapids, which was a cool and surreal feeling.

 

[red langford]

Steady winds I estimate my max solo is about 30km/h, gusty winds are a different story. I can manage 20km/h easily enough but at the 30 it'd have to be ideal conditions. Those speeds are of course estimates.

 

[frozentripper]

There's a kayak book which I unfortunately can't remember the title of... for kayaks normally used to travelling 5 km/hr, a wind of 25 km/hr will slow progress down to zero, unless more energy is put out to move forward. A prospector will have more frontal area and create more drag so the wind and drag effects will be greater.

For me, 5 km/hr in a canoe isn't bad, so a 25 km/hr upper limit might be reasonable if those kinds of winds are being forecast and a decision has to be made (wind speed forecasts have been unreliable at times unless winds are forecast to be insanely high in which case forget it), and lake basin wind channeling effects make prediction more difficult.

For a relaxed afternoon and evening of paddling, a wind of 20 km/hr being forecast by Environment Canada is enough to make me think about other things. But they've been wrong often enough so maybe a day paddle on an open lake is a go anyway at 20 km, depending on how badly I want to get out there.

 

[yellowcanoe]

Solo things get unhappy for me at 30 km/hr ( we did have an anemometer) and in the Everglades with no where to hide we had to fight to get to camp at 40 km/hr. The wind may have been slightly less cause we took readings on shore and the wind seemed to be increasing.. This was dedicated solos which have less skin and surface area exposed to wind than a Prospector.

 

[Alan Gage]

I've paddled in 15-20mph (24-32kph) winds at times and while not fun I can make good enough forward progress in a solo to make it worth being on the water if I need/want to move (about 3mph by GPS). At this point the waves are capping and high enough that they're coming over the bow a little now and again.

I had one occasion on a trip where I was crossing a 1/2 mile wide channel into a headwind that I'd guess was around 15mph. About half way across the wind suddenly picked up intensity and I think I'd be safe to say it was at least 25mph (40kph) and probably 30 (48kph). It was by far the strongest wind I'd ever paddled into and it brought me to a near standstill. I never would have attempted the crossing if it had been blowing that hard at the start, nor do I think I could have even if I'd tried. It was one of those situations you mention where because of topography the water was relatively calm. I struggled ahead and finally got close enough to the opposite shore to get a reprieve from the wind and continue on in the lee.

Most of the situations where I paddled into strong winds were with a loaded tripping canoe which I think probably helped by making the wind less prone to blowing the boat around.

Alan

 

[sweeper]

18 mph was my max, didn't like it much, (also had an anemometer), on a small lake so the waves didn't have a lot of time to build.

 

[Bothwell Voyageur]

Thanks for the replies.

On this last outing once we emerged from the river delta on to the lake we rafted up and were able to ferry glide across the wind to reach the shore next to a cottage. From there we had a 20 minute hike to reach my car and drive back to collect the canoes.

If we had been in the one canoe I think we would have been stuck until the wind died.

 

[dougd]

I've been on a couple of trips where the whirlpool from your paddle stroke moves ahead of you. Time to call it quits and hunker down for a bit even though it may mean paddling into the night. That's not a bad thing sometimes.

 

[alsg]

This spring I was out on the tidal Potomac in downtown DC enjoying the Cherry Blossoms when the wind picked up. I was solo paddling my tandem (a Gilpatrick design which is probably a lot like Prospector). Progress became increasingly difficult until at about 200 yards from my take out at the end of the main runway at Reagan Airport I was exhausted and pretty much stopped dead. I don't carry an anemometer like some of you but I checked the weather records for the airport when I got home and there was a steady 20 mph head wind at Reagan at the time. Oh, and the tide was coming in! I might still be out there if it hadn't been for a friendly Canadian running along the river who spotted me and came down to the shore and offered to hop in. With him in the bow, the two of us easily cut through it for the final 200 yards. But solo, forget about it. Here's a shot from earlier in the day when it wasn't so windy.

 

[gumpus]

Well BV, I think your estimate of 45-50 kph fits my experience. I've been in headwinds strong enough that I wondered if my paddle would break as I fought for every inch and I think the wind speeds were around 30-35 mph with gusts well over that. In my experience the wind speed is never steady...there are always gusts and if you are out for a few hours the wind speed is likely to change (sometimes for the better and sometimes for the worse). I've also found that it's not good to try to overpower wind gusts...just let them wash over you and then use your power during the lulls between gusts.

 

[Guest]

Ignoring the effects of wave action, what is the maximum wind speed a couple of average Joe paddlers in a regular prospector style canoe can still make headway?

I can not recall many episodes of high winds with no wave effect, maybe a few times on serpentine riparian valley streams or on dense swamp trips, where the wind was whipping the tree tops but of little regard down on the water. And a Prospector hull would be my unlikeliest choice on a windswept trip.

Being Merican I had to convert the KMH to MPH. USA, USA, USA! And Myanmar and Liberia.

I think your estimate of 45-50 kph fits my experience. I've been in headwinds strong enough that I wondered if my paddle would break as I fought for every inch and I think the wind speeds were around 30-35 mph with gusts well over that.

A lot of things come into play in windy conditions, wave height generated, trim and exposed freeboard, decked canoe or spray cover, is there a place to hide before I am utterly exhausted, single blade vs double blade, effective wind ferry slip angle vs waves. Even how fresh I am, and how much I need to make that distance today.

Wind direction and wave fetch distance count even more. A strenuous mile across a small lake may seem a reasonable effort (gamble).

The most sphincter puckered I have ever been in an open canoe was a 6 mile stretch down a long narrow lake. A narrow lake with fierce tailwind, and 20 miles of unobstructed of oops-unconsidered open fetch.

It took less than an hour, probably closer to 45 minutes. Seemed a lifetime; it was like surfing edge-of-disaster Atlantic breakers the entire ride.

The likeliest scenario there, my hastily considered Plan A, after I was out in the oh-crap maelstrom, was I will swim to shore, walk back to my truck, find the Hide-a-key and drive home alive but without canoe or gear. I have never been relieved to reach a take out, especially one tucked back in a calm, wind sheltered cove. I could not even extract myself from the canoe for some relieved minutes to kiss the gravel at the take out.

Up to 30 kmh/under 20 MPH I can still make good headway given an appropriate hull design. At 40 kmh/25 mph it is no fun and there better be an island to hide behind soon. At 50 kmh/30+ mph I better be in a decked canoe and a wave fetch of manageable height, and even so the wind is grabbing my feathered paddle blade every stroke, I really need to find some shelter to hide behind and rest, hydrate and fill calories and dammit this is just plain stupid.

Even if I can safely make reasonable headway I may meet with an unstoppable force beyond occasional wait-em-out gusts.

On a windy day on the Green just below Crystal Geyser a companion behind me called out Hey, stop for a minute, I need to adjust my foot brace. I was in a fast/narrow section just ahead, in a decently strong current but with a stiff wind blowing white capped standing waves. When I stopped paddling I blew upriver backwards; not the most comforting position in standing waves with a day one of a three week trip in fully loaded canoe.

That spray covered canoe had an absurd amount of weight in it, including potable water, which did did nothurt with forward momentum as long as I kept paddling, but even well sunk in the current it was no match for the upriver wind when I stopped.

On a coastal trip, exiting a sheltered sneak route into an unfortunately V shaped embayment, I made decent if strenuous progress against the building wind and wave for a half mile or so. Until I came to what must have been the focal point of the funnel, where the wind speed and wave height reached a noticeably crescendo.

I needed to go but another hundred yards to an escape, and giving it 100% of what I had, with a double blade, in a decked canoe, it was just not possible. Paddling as hard as I could my progress was measured in inches (2.54 cm to the rest of the world) per minute. Not happening.

There was no turning 180 in the waves at that point of exposure. I had to delicately back out the half mile I had made, bow into the wind and waves. It was one time I really wished I had a rearview mirror on the Monarch.

In battling high winds having strategized a route with a place to hide (or give up) has become part of my decision making.

 

[Alan Gage]

As some have mentioned hull choice makes a big difference. I usually don't paddle in high winds unless I'm on a trip because other than that it's just local day trips and I can always find something more enjoyable to do at home than paddle in the wind. My trips have always been in a 16' solo that goes straight better than it turns and I have a decent sit and switch stroke with a lightweight carbon paddle. I have other hulls that have higher sides and more rocker that work better with single side correction strokes rather than hit and switch. With those hulls I'd give up much sooner in the wind.

Alan

 

[Odyssey]

I have no empirical proof only anecdotal say so. At times wind and waves have joined to make paddling hellish, and at other times only the wind has teased my forward progression. It helps I'm sure having a lower slimmer profile of sorts than a prospector. Solo in an empty canoe I've had to fight gusts of I guesstimate to have been around 15+ km/h. Doable but danged difficult. Waves weren't the issue, only the wind tugging at my bow. A couple of times I've had to resort to scrambling forwards and over the thwarts to paddle bow heavy into the wind whichever pointy end happens to be the "bow" at that tense moment. Awkward and uncomfortable but somewhat effective. I'm clumsy at the hit and switch so that didn't help. I must be a sinner because my prayers for perfect conditions for relaxed leaning don't always show up. But last fall I played with the gusty winds by tacking and sculling from lee to lee, the islands aiding in my misadventures. It was actually fun, but there were lulls between the wind gusts. That gave me time to correct any misdirection. Tandem tripping has been different, as paddling with a full load has permitted us to power through keeping us quite dry, but to be honest the strong waves made us nervous wrecks. Big Trout Lake Algonquin and Lake Temagami come to mind. I'll never know if we've been good or lucky, or both, but I keep promising my wife we'll never challenge wind and wave again. I guesstimate those conditions to have been around 20+ km/h. Load, trim and canoe profile make all the difference I think. And experience. I admit we're probably lacking in that.

 

[frozentripper]

Windbound photo, in the Algonquin park area with wind funnelling past a constricted point... this is from a relatively sheltered area, you would not want to be in a canoe being blown downwind like Mike describes. Through binoculars there were whitecaps visible further along and rough water on jagged rocks on the distant shore, probably not a happy moment over there. Adding to the nervousness, this was just after ice-out with freezing cold water. And Environment Canada had predicted light winds, calm towards evening... I have no idea what the wind speed actually was, with all the shoreline wind channelling and funnelling going on.

This is more like it... there are wind gusts blackening the water, but the river is sheltered and safe.

 

[sweeper]

Just returned home a day early from a weekend trip to the ADK, the forecast was for 10-15mph winds with gust to 30.