alcohol stove fuel (Trangia)

[Odyssey]

I recently bought an alcohol stove to use as a simple and light weight alternative to other methods, such as wood fires, naptha stoves etc. I thought it was a simple gear option until I started considering the fuels available.
If you have an alky stove which fuel do you prefer, and why?
Here's an interesting vlog that was helpful to me. (Canadian content eh?) Hope it helps you too.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQ3VEwCDhS0

 

[Alan Gage]

I use denatured alcohol. I buy it by the gallon (from the hardware store) for use in the shop so it's always handy for me to decant some for a trip. I don't know if it goes by the same name in Canada or not. This burns nice and clean. I pour it into pop or juice bottles to carry it on trips.

I once tried some isopropyl alcohol (gas line anti-freeze) we use at our repair shop for cleanup and it didn't burn as well and was sooty.

I've heard that if you want to use HEET (fuel line anti-freeze) you should use the stuff in the yellow bottle. I stopped at a convenience store in Canada to pick some up and they didn't have the 'HEET' brand but the brand they did carry had the familiar looking red and yellow bottles. I grabbed a yellow bottle and wish that I hadn't. I knew something was wrong when I topped off my Trangia and it had a cloudy look to it. I lit it anyway and got a low temperature sooty flame. After it finished cooking the bannock I let it keep burning until it was all burned off (took forever). Next time I went to use my stove I couldn't get the cap to twist off. There's an o-ring on the cap to seal it up and I'm guessing there was a reaction with the fuel or maybe it had left a sticky residue. That was on my last trip in February and I still haven't gotten the cap off. Channel locks are doing nothing but crushing it so I guess I'll need some strap wrenches. Maybe I'll try heating it up first. Curious to see what I find when I get it open.

Anyway, just be careful about experimenting with different fuels.

Alan

 

[Bothwell Voyageur]

Ethanol based stove fuel is pretty much impossible to get in Canada due to the alcohol restrictions, it's all methanol (methyl hydrate) or propanol.

Some stoves will burn propanol successfully but mostly Canadians will have to stick with meths and put up with slightly longer boil times.

 

[jcavenagh]

I just use HEET in the yellow bottle. Don't use the other type(red bottle) as its ISO. Is HEET not available at Canadian auto parts stores?
Here is another vid about this issue https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mt69fbNhCgs

 

[Bothwell Voyageur]

I just use HEET in the yellow bottle. Don't use the other type(red bottle) as its ISO. Is HEET not available at Canadian auto parts stores?
Here is another vid about this issue https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mt69fbNhCgs

no, it is not sold in Canada.

Ethanol sales are more restricted here.

 

[Adk Keith]

I buy it by the gallon here in the states, but rubbing alcohol will work. Just make sure you get 90% and not the 70%.

 

[Alan Gage]

I took the time to watch those videos and now I'm more confused than ever. On the Canadian based one he ran through 3 different denatured alcohols but never said what the difference between them was. Is there an actual chemical difference or just in the way they were marketed? He did say the Fondue fuel was safe to use inside but what is it about it that makes it safe to burn inside? Does it still burn the same as the others?

When I buy denatured alchohol here in the states it's sometimes called 'boat stove fuel'. I've always assumed the chemical makeup was the same but maybe I'm wrong.

But what really confused me the most after watching the two videos that were linked is.....What's the correct way to pronounce Trangia?

Alan

 

[Bothwell Voyageur]

I buy it by the gallon here in the states, but rubbing alcohol will work. Just make sure you get 90% and not the 70%.

rubbing alcohol in Canada uses propanol

Methanol fumes are toxic so burning in an enclosed space is likely not a good idea.

 

[Odyssey]

But what really confused me the most after watching the two videos that were linked is.....What's the correct way to pronounce Trangia?

Alan

It's "Trangia, eh."

I'm going to try the fondue fuel. The safety factor is what sells me on it. I intended to use this stove purely as a back up to wood or twig fires, and wanted the ability to burn the alky in confined spaces, such as in our tent vestibule. I wouldn't attempt other fuels like this. Obviously I won't try this in tight spaces. Our Hubba Hubba vestibule is described as a "gear shed". A tad optimistic perhaps, but roomy enough to boil a pot of water I think.
I appreciate everyone's input here. I originally assumed this little stove would be a simple thing. Now I'm rethinking my Vargo Triad altogether.

 

[Odyssey]

Okay, I came across two conflicting video statements. One said higher alcohol content leads to cleaner burning, while another said "add water to reduce soot", ie lower content is cleaner. Which is it? I assumed H2O contributes to incomplete combustion.

 

[red langford]

I use methyl hydrate I get from the hardware store. Works fine and not sooty.

 

[redoleary]

I'm a fan of denatured alcohol aka marine stove fuel. Burns clean, is reasonably cheap, and I can keep it in an empty pop bottle for bringing on a trip.

 

[Iskweo]

I have access to denatured alchohol that several people have used in their Trangia and it works pretty good. You can only really get it here through an industrial supply. We use it for parts cleaning.

 

[snapper]

I use HEET in the yellow bottle most of the time and denatured alcohol when I can't find it; although every auto store in my parts carries the HEET. As for the cleanliness of the burn, neither fuel has ever given me soot and they can be carried in any lightweight plastic bottle. I use an old Sprite bottle since the green color clues me into the contents being fuel and not water. It works for me and my simple brain but you might like a different set-up.

That's all for now. Best of luck with your new stove. Enjoy using it and until next time....be well.

snapper

PS - I haven't found any real difference in burning time between the two fuels. What really matters is whether you have a good wind screen or not.

 

[wgiles]

Ethanol is generally the best fuel as it has the highest heat of combustion. 12,800 BTU/Lb for Ethanol vs. 9800 BTU/Lb for Methanol. Methanol is more volatile than Ethanol and is a good choice for colder temperatures. Yellow HEET is almost pure Methanol and, where available, comes in convenient little bottles. Denatured Alcohol, in the US or Methylated Spirits, where available, should be 95% Ethanol and 5% water plus some kind of poison, often Methanol, but not necessarily. There are numerous stories of Denatured Alcohol being a mix of who knows what and causing all sorts of stove problems. I have never found that to be true. Here in the US, good Denatured Alcohol is almost always available in the paint department, since it is used with Shellac. The size choices are more limited with Quart and Gallon cans being the usual sizes. Most people use empty soda bottles or small Platypus bottles to store the alcohol. I would be wary of any gas line antifreezes that I wasn't familiar with unless the ingredients are clearly spelled out. It is important not to use any petroleum products with rubber parts unless those rubber parts are specifically made for petroleum products. Most O-Rings are Buna-N and are compatible with Petroleum. Some rubbers are not and will swell and decompose.

 

[old tom]

Tried the alcohol burning part of my Ti-Tri last fall, wasn't impressed. It worked fine in warm temps, but on a cold morning (just slightly below freezing) it would barely burn. This year I'll bring a pint or two of ever-clear. Supposed to be 98% pure, so should burn more easily, and if it's still useless in the cold, a few drops in orange gatorade should warm me up just fine! Have to love those multi-purpose items!

 

[Sweetfancymoses]

12,800 BTU/Lb for Ethanol vs. 9800 BTU/Lb for Methanol.

Isopropanol (yellow Heet):14,346 BTU/Lb

Source:

http://www.servicechamp.com/images/28202msds.pdf
https://pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/compound/isopropanol#section=Heat-of-Combustion

 

[Bothwell Voyageur]

In cold weather you may need to preheat the burner or at least insulate it from the ground depending on which stove you are using.

Yes propanol has more BTUs but the majority of stoves can't supply enough oxygen to make it burn cleanly, hence the sooty flame.

Yellow HEET is methanol based. The red bottle is isopropanol, labelled ISO-HEET

 

[wgiles]

Isopropanol (yellow Heet):14,346 BTU/Lb

Source:

http://www.servicechamp.com/images/28202msds.pdf
https://pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/compound/isopropanol#section=Heat-of-Combustion

Isopropanol is not Yellow HEET it is red Iso-HEET, which does not normally work well in alcohol stoves. Yellow HEET is almost pure Methanol. Methanol doesn't have quite the heat value of Ethanol, but it is more volatile and works in lower temperatures.

https://www.goldeagle.com/product/heet-gas-line-antifreeze-water-remover

I don't have a direct link to the SDS for yellow HEET, but I was able to get it from the manufacturer's site. The main advantages to Yellow HEET include availability (at least in the US), small bottle size and low temperature operation. The major disadvantage is toxicity. Don't get it on your skin and don't breathe the vapors. The combustion products of Ethanol and Methanol are pretty much the same. They are clean burning, but still need adequate ventilation.

Heats of combustion for various alcohols can be found here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_of_combustion

Alcohols are way down the page.

I was playing around with a Chinese Trangia clone last night and fired it up on Yellow HEET. It worked fine.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/142267544601?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

I want to compare the alcohol stoves to twigs if the wind ever dies down.

 

[yknpdlr]

I want to compare the alcohol stoves to twigs if the wind ever dies down.

You can actually use a Trangia burner in the bottom of a Kelly Kettle. It works, but I haven't made any efficiency comparisons with twigs. Denatured (Ethanol) Alcohol is readily available in the paint section of hardware stores here in NY, that's what I use in my Trangia.