My First Canoe Build

[Cruiser]

DC ... you don't need a "guide", just a piece of angle iron like this:

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Jim has posted about making strips with just a skilsaw quite a few times, even has a short video (although not up to your quality, sry JIM). You can move the canoe off the strongback and set that up as your ripping table (I have pics of that in my current build) and save setting up a new one.

It isn't just for making strips though, any long length cuts, like your gunnels are very easy to do this way. Make the angle iron about the length of the saw and from 1/2" or 3/4" on a side, clamp it to your saw and instant guide. Sit the saw on the board and it will follow any bend or twist and give the same dimension through the entire cut. I cut some strips from a skarfed 20' piece of white cedar, with a bow of about 20" and it cut perfect, the strips are flexible so once cut, they stay straight.

You can still cut 3/4" gunnels, I am just saying that by the time you finish you will have a gunnel top that is over 2" wide, that is a lot of wood just for a gunnel IMO. Regardless of whether you reduce the gunnel dimensions, once you get them cut, the warp/bow can be oriented to work in your favour to better follow the sheer (it isn't straight either). and if you make the gunnels a little thinner, they will also be more flexible. So I suspect the board may seem bad, but it shouldn't be much of a problem.

If you go to say 1/2" and worry about hanging the seats, just add a 1/4" strip at the seat hanging point and taper it down at both ends. Gives you the real estate to hang the seats, treat the piece as a feature and you save a lot of ounces on the rest of the gunnel.

This is a pic from my Freedom 17 build, if you look at the seat area, you can see what I mean (gunnels were 3/8" btw)

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Just to get a feel for the material, maybe make up a few test slats (just a couple feet long), I just finished doing quite a bit of work with ash, and it is a very strong, stiff wood. Bend the test slats a bit, get a feel for the wood, then base your decision on what you held in your hands and what your gut tells you ... advice can be offered, but it always needs to be taken cautiously and then applied as you feel best.

Brian

 

[dcloots]

Today was a strange day. Figured I would accomplish many tasks, however, I dealt with other distractions and could not settle on a ripping solution. I did, however employ my strongback and the rigging I mentioned earlier was my effort to somehow figure a way to deal with the bows and rip the strips. I washed my hands clear of my distractions and headed right to this forum. I now have the answer I was looking for the whole time. This is invaluable to me and now I can move forward. Appreciate the advice on this one. Great stuff Brian, Jim and Alsg!

I also understand more conceptually of the thinner gunwales and a beefier section for the seat hangers. I think I have to thin out the gunwales a bit to 5/8” at least. Epoxy the beef to the inwale where the seats will lay.

 

[Sven]

I totally agree with Brian on the gunwale thickness.
On my first build I used 3/4”x3/4” for inners and outers, and it was way overkill, and certainly added quite a few pounds. My inners were cedar and outers were hickory.
extremely durable but heavy! I certainly didn’t need 3/4” wide inwales since I mounted my seats via cleats. Probably didn’t need inners at all with hickory outers.
On my second build I used walnut for my gunwales and dimensioned them to 3/8”x3/4”, plenty strong and cut the weight exponentially.
Trim options are like dessert, it’s where you really start to pack on the pounds if you’re not careful!

 

[Jim Dodd]

A Magnesium base like Cruiser uses, is nice as it seems to slide on the Cedar a little easier !

If it works on your saw ? I like a small Vise grip for the front clamp ! It makes a good handle, giving you better control, it keeps your hand away from the blade too !

I use 3/4" x 3/4" x 1/8" thick Aluminum angle. ( Menard's has it. I cut the edge of the angle, that rides against the plank. down to about 5/8". In case I cut a plank thinner than 3/4". and I do.

A pic of the Aluminum angle. You can vary the length of the Angle to suit you ! Really 12" long is about right.



another pic. A 5 gal. bucket makes a great place to rest your saw when not in your hand, cutting strips !

Gunnels are easily cut with the same saw, if they are cut from 1x stock.

 

[Cruiser]

Sven makes a good point, if weight is a build factor, it is interesting to calculate the weight of all the trim you are setting up to add. Wood density is easy to get ... do a Google search with (Ash Wood Database" and up will pop all the characteristics of your chosen wood.

Ash is 42 #/ft^3 ... so at (3/4 x 3/4 x 12)/ 1728 = 0.164 #s per foot of gunnel ... extending that to 4 x 16' gunnels, gives 4 x 16 x .164 = 10.5 pounds. Reducing from 3/4 x 3/4 to 3/4 x 1/2 will yield 7 pounds ... a difference of 3.5 pounds. You can also reduce the height to 5/8" and save a bit more. The point is that gunnels are heavy, trim can be heavy and it is the one place a builder can add a lot of weight without realizing it, it is just a gunnel, just a deck ....

That's why I was suggesting you make a couple test strips at different dimensions, to get an idea of what the various sized gunnels bring to the table (so to speak) ... for your build, this is just carrying that decision making process from stripping, glassing etc. to the rest of the build.

You are in the home stretch and all is looking good, you are going to be so happy when you finally hit the water.


Brian

 

[dcloots]

Cut all my blanks today!!! I used a wooden piece clamped to the Skillsaw using two C clamps. Although angle iron was recommended I thought I would try the wood. The wood worked well and slid with very little realized friction and at the end of each cut I reverified dimension. Thank you gentlemen for the advice. Due to the bowing of the ash wood I thought for sure “I was up shoots creek without a poodle”! Thanks again!!!!

 

[alsg]

Wonderful! Glad it worked! Are you going to screw them on or epoxy them on? In either case, I hope you have a LOT of C-clamps!! The cheapos from Harbor Freight worked well for me.

 

[dcloots]

I will be screwing the gunwales. I definitely don’t have enough C clamps. Harbor Freight is perfect for this!

Also I decided on 1/2” thickness of the gunwales per Cruisers recommendation. Goal is to keep the weight as low as possible.

I used wood as my skillsaw guide since I didn’t have any angle iron in the preferred size. Time is precious to me in the morning and I needed to get creative using the same concept of guiding the saw without sacrificing a trip to the depot. Alsg, I think you may have recommended the wood option. I will definitely use this method when cutting my cedar strips for my next canoe. As reliable as table saws are this is clearly the more effective method for accuracy.

 

[alsg]

Alsg, I think you may have recommended the wood option.

I did. Now here's my confession: I haven't used this technique myself. But I knew it would work based on Jim Dodd's posts.

 

[dcloots]

Well good on you Alsg...it worked! The other option for me would have been to use angle iron that weighed just as much as the saw

 

[Cruiser]

Hey DC, if you are going to add this to your "bag o tricks", consider getting a Diablo (or whatever) 24 tooth, will rip that way better .... glad you have that done and managed to salvage your wood.


Brian

 

[dcloots]

Sven makes a good point, if weight is a build factor, it is interesting to calculate the weight of all the trim you are setting up to add. Wood density is easy to get ... do a Google search with (Ash Wood Database" and up will pop all the characteristics of your chosen wood.

Ash is 42 #/ft^3 ... so at (3/4 x 3/4 x 12)/ 1728 = 0.164 #s per foot of gunnel ... extending that to 4 x 16' gunnels, gives 4 x 16 x .164 = 10.5 pounds. Reducing from 3/4 x 3/4 to 3/4 x 1/2 will yield 7 pounds ... a difference of 3.5 pounds. You can also reduce the height to 5/8" and save a bit more. The point is that gunnels are heavy, trim can be heavy and it is the one place a builder can add a lot of weight without realizing it, it is just a gunnel, just a deck ....

That's why I was suggesting you make a couple test strips at different dimensions, to get an idea of what the various sized gunnels bring to the table (so to speak) ... for your build, this is just carrying that decision making process from stripping, glassing etc. to the rest of the build.

You are in the home stretch and all is looking good, you are going to be so happy when you finally hit the water.


Brian

I managed to rip my blanks for the gunwales yesterday to 1” x 1/2”. Today was all about discovering a method to reduce the 1” thickness to 5/8”. I moved things around in the workshop and utilized my table saw. I always knew there was a good reason why I put end windows in my basement. I extended the stock outside the window for the Infeed and had plenty of room for the outfeed. Ripped the 1” blanks down to 5/8”. I know this method will not be perfect and there may be some irregularities but overall the stock matches up quite well.

Final gunwale dimensions after ripping 5/8” x 1/2”. Now I figure I wil have approx 1 1/4” thickness to slightly more after inside glassing. What is the groups consensus on what size screws to use to get a good solid bite on the inwale and outwale? Look forward to hearing some recommendations!

 

[Cruiser]

I have to yield to the "screwers" in here ... I only ever epoxy them on.

Brian

 

[dcloots]

I have to yield to the "screwers" in here ... I only ever epoxy them on.

Brian

That is definitely an option that I should consider as well.

 

[alsg]

Maybe the guys who have done that size gunnel can pipe up. But for material, silicon bronze.

 

[Roybrew]

How often do you have to replace a gunwale? I know accidents happen, but I couldn't imagine abusing a wooden canoe to the point of ruining the gunwales. Some rubs from dragging the paddle shaft along them, and few rubs from transporting I would call that character. I screwed wood gunwales to my 13ft Mohawk, I didn't like the plastic ones and I was enjoying just seeing what it was like to do it, but sealing the holes was something I thought may be an issue. I keep my canoes in the dry, so I have never had a wood rot problem.
I am also thinking ahead for my own build.

 

[Jim Dodd]

If you do a search on this site, you will find a bunch of ideas for gunnels ! Pick and choose !
Jim

 

[Cruiser]

If you do decide to epoxy them ... make sure you also have enough clamps. I have quite a few ... I bought them on sale

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Now for the current build, I have a wack of Jimmi clamps that I think will be a lot easier and faster than these.

Brian

 

[Jim Dodd]

I didn't need them all ! But at the time I had them all ready !

 

[dcloots]

My latest video on YouTube. Here is the link if interested.

Part 11, Ripping Gunwales, Sanding Seal Coat, Fiberglassing Inside
https://youtu.be/vLWm_PJkjsE